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Let's End Adolescence

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Re: Let's End Adolescence

#81

Post by shaunxcode »

nir wrote: post #6

The 3 stage process of childhood - adolescence - adulthood is already irrelevant in many affluent Western countries, but what was removed isn't adolescence but adulthood. Many 40 year olds manage their lives as teenagers (look at the low birth rate in western Europe, or high divorce rate in the US) and vice versa - teenagers build $15b (if you believe it ;)) companies.

What about people that choose to turn their "parental instinct" to have and nurture children towards helping their society as a whole instead? Is that also a sign of immaturity for lack of "progeny"?

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#82

Post by omouse »

mynameishere wrote: post #24
Dilpil wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason republicans so frequently tout this line is because they fundamentally misunderstand the purpose of education. Newt and company believe that education is essentially career training, and as such cannot fathom why kids need to be learning things like calculus and biology. The real purpose of education is to turn people into intellectuals. Industry does not want to simply hire people who know exactly how to…

and as such cannot fathom why kids need to be learning things like calculus and biology I'm pretty sure that Gingrich who is a professor, and every other republican who has ever considered the question in any way, recognizes the use and purpose of calculus and biology. But don't let reason get in the way of your mindless contempt. The real purpose of education is to turn people into intellectuals No, it isn't, unless…

No it doesn't. Period. Even the relatively "creative" jobs like software engineering want a fundamental skill set and raw intelligence, not the ability to quote Chomsky.

Right, but the people who have the ability to quote Chomsky may be able to transfer that skill and quote Knuth or Sedgewick instead.

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#83

Post by wumi »

we've traded focus & specialization for broad generalized learning in the hopes of producing 'well rounded' individuals (at least officially). While great in theory, in practice it fattens the coffers of our nation's largest (private) universities & secondary education systems.

i.e. apprenticeship v. general education

fact: public universities will increase tuition when the number of students graduating with degrees in <4 years increases.

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#84

Post by greendestiny »

wallflower wrote: post #33
mynameishere wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and as such cannot fathom why kids need to be learning things like calculus and biology I'm pretty sure that Gingrich who is a professor, and every other republican who has ever considered the question in any way, recognizes the use and purpose of calculus and biology. But don't let reason get in the way of your mindless contempt. The real purpose of education is to turn people into intellectuals No, it isn't, unless…

> The real purpose of education is to turn people into intellectuals Reminds me of something Seth Godin (?) once said - that the whole purpose of school is to institutionalize mediocrity

Everyone says that. If anything is mediocre its this realization.

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#85

Post by swombat »

tlrobinson wrote: post #73
swombat wrote: post #66

I discarded this guy's argument once I read this paragraph: And experiments such as the one my daughter, Jackie Cushman, is running in Atlanta—where poor children are paid the equivalent of working in a fast-food restaurant to study and do their homework—are examples of a more dynamic future. How is being paid to study and do homework an example of early adulthood? One huge difference between adults and non-adults is…

"This guy" is Newt Gingrich, btw.

Being famous doesn't preclude being illogical.

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#87

Post by tdavis »

dpatru wrote: post #29
tdavis wrote: post #4

While I wholeheartedly agree that there are many things wrong with "kids these days," completely abolishing adolescence would... what's a good word here... suck! Look, I did my fair share of dumb stuff when I was younger, most of which was done in the name of boredom. But what's the alternative here? "Happy 13th birthday, son, now go get a job!"? If high STD and drug use rates tell us anything, it's that these young…

"But what's the alternative here? 'Happy 13th birthday, son, now go get a job!'?" What's wrong with making 13 year-olds support themselves? Why do parents owe their children support? Why should a single mom have to bust her butt to support her 13 year-old son who is bigger and stronger than she is so that he can have plenty of time to hang out with his friends, play video games, do sports, take drugs, etc.? In my min…

Why should a single mom have to bust her butt to support her 13 year-old son...

Because she birthed him. Look, if a 13 year old kid wants to get a job, more power to them. However, if they don't, it's the parents' responsibility to provide for that child until they're an adult mainly because, at least in this society, kids aren't raised to be factory workers by 13.

You're looking at it from a perhaps pragmatic point of view, but you're missing the human factor; children aren't some investment you can liquidate if it doesn't work out. Having a child is a conscious decision to bring another human being into this world -- a human being who never actually asked to be brought. Once you do that it becomes your responsibility to care for and raise that person (or find someone else who can) regardless of whether or not they provide a return on investment.

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#88

Post by nir »

shaunxcode wrote: post #81
nir wrote: post #6

The 3 stage process of childhood - adolescence - adulthood is already irrelevant in many affluent Western countries, but what was removed isn't adolescence but adulthood. Many 40 year olds manage their lives as teenagers (look at the low birth rate in western Europe, or high divorce rate in the US) and vice versa - teenagers build $15b (if you believe it ;)) companies.

What about people that choose to turn their "parental instinct" to have and nurture children towards helping their society as a whole instead? Is that also a sign of immaturity for lack of "progeny"?

I don't think people who choose not to have kids are immature, it's a legitimate choice. I just mention it as a measure of certain changes. Nothing necessarily bad or good about it.

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#89

Post by JesseAldridge »

swombat wrote: post #66

I discarded this guy's argument once I read this paragraph: And experiments such as the one my daughter, Jackie Cushman, is running in Atlanta—where poor children are paid the equivalent of working in a fast-food restaurant to study and do their homework—are examples of a more dynamic future. How is being paid to study and do homework an example of early adulthood? One huge difference between adults and non-adults is…

You discarded all of it because you didn't like that one part? This type of behavior always annoys me. There are lots of interesting and important thoughts here. I agree that these ideas need to be closely examined and refined a great deal before being put into practice -- but I'm not just going to shout "FAIL" -- because while that may be gratifying to the ego, it is utterly counter-productive.

Re: Let's End Adolescence

#90

Post by jimbokun »

tomjen wrote: post #63
nir wrote: post #6

The 3 stage process of childhood - adolescence - adulthood is already irrelevant in many affluent Western countries, but what was removed isn't adolescence but adulthood. Many 40 year olds manage their lives as teenagers (look at the low birth rate in western Europe, or high divorce rate in the US) and vice versa - teenagers build $15b (if you believe it ;)) companies.

I don't believe that a low birth rate says anything about when people grow up. If it did, teenage mothers would be the most responsible people in society.

You know, a teenage mother raised a man who was just elected to the most powerful position on Earth.

Anecdotal, yes. But your comment relies on a stereotype. How do we know that teenage mothers do not quickly start maturing from the point they become teenage mothers, relative to their peers? They almost have no choice.

(I say that knowing of some concrete counter-examples to what I just argued. But that's just anecdotes, too.)

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