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I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

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Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#221

Post by delecti »

JoBrad wrote: post #158
riskable wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I never understood why people put smart speakers in their showers. Why is a simple and cheap Bluetooth speaker not good enough? You can get them in any size and shape and sound quality and they (can) work with your phone's built-in "smart" assistant. I never use that though because when I'm in the shower all I want to do is listen to music. Here's my routine, for reference: 1. Turn on the speaker (which is hanging on…

Because I don’t have to remember to pair my phone with the Bluetooth speaker, then queue up whatever. I just tell my Echo to play my daily briefing, and it does the work. I picked a set that is generally done in 15-20 minutes, so it doubles as a good time for my morning routine.

In the described use-case, you don't have to re-pair your phone, you just turn the speaker on and it reconnects automatically. Both phone OSs work that way, reconnecting automatically to known devices.

Also, the daily briefing is a different use-case than was described above, where the GP commenter just wanted to play music.

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#222

Post by jahewson »

Corrado wrote: post #2

I feel like this is just one more thing that Google leadership is failing at. I have some similar examples to the ones in the article. I recommended that my brother-in-law get a Google wifi AP some years ago. Recently, I got an email from Google saying that they are no longer supporting it and after a certain date you will no longer be able to make changes to it. WTF?!? My Apple Airport Extreme is older than the Goog…

I’m using Nest without a Google Account. It nags me to migrate but I’ve never done so. I deleted my Google account because I was using a custom domain and Google moved that functionality to Workspace and wanted to charge for it, while half of Google products don’t support it fully and there was no migration path to a regular account. I could pay for something broken or loose all my data. So I wrote some scripts and migrated to iCloud.

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#223

Post by surajrmal »

tacocataco wrote: post #146

I feel like if a product is abandoned it should become freeware for all to use so the electronic devices involved have a less of a chance to become ewaste. Kind of how copyright (was supposed to) work, giving access to the public eventually.

Unfortunately it's often not entirely up to the company to decide. They likely use components and software written by various other companies which require strict controls over who may have access to it. The nature of those contracts would have to change first.

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#224

Post by cfeduke »

Google has done the same thing to Nest Secure. I removed an ADT system from my office because the monthly monitoring from ADT was $39.99 - the ADT system came with the office. I installed the Nest Secure cameras and system myself, even running USB power outside the office through the masonry. The monitoring was adequate - notifications sent to my phone - and Internet storage pricing was acceptable. But as of April 2024 the service is being shut down and I can opt to have an ADT system installed - a $485 value! - and pay a monthly monitoring fee. (Or I can receive a $200 credit on the Google store, presumably to buy some other technology they are going to sunset.)

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#225

Post by SparkyMcUnicorn »

cabalamat wrote: post #208
titzer wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prior to replacing my furnace I had a mercury thermostat that was easily over 50 years old. The new one is digital but isn't "smart". I don't expect 50 years, but 20-30 seems reasonable. Somehow software people have forgotten that physical things last a long time, and people want them to keep working and stay the same as long as possible . My thermostat doesn't need "upgrades", and anyone who thinks they are going to…

> The new one is digital but isn't "smart". I do not, nor will I ever use, any "smart" device. "Smart" devices are - unnecessarily complicated - privacy destroying - overpriced - vendor lock-in - often infected with online ads you can't get rid of - likely to stop working if the vendor goes bust, their business model changes, or they just feel like it IMO, it is rarely or never a smart decision to get a "smart" devic…

I fully respect when anyone decides they don't want smart devices, but all of your bullet points are quite easy to accomplish with off the shelf devices these days ("unnecessarily complicated" will always be debatable though).

All of my lights, outlets, and dozens of other niche things, never connect to the internet, and everything is fully functional when there's no internet connection.

Home Assistant with Zigbee devices is fantastic for avoiding vendor lock-in[0]. EspHome and Tasmota fill in nicely for if/when you want wifi devices.

[0] https://zigbee.blakadder.com/all.html

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#226

Post by clnq »

__MatrixMan__ wrote: post #172
titzer wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prior to replacing my furnace I had a mercury thermostat that was easily over 50 years old. The new one is digital but isn't "smart". I don't expect 50 years, but 20-30 seems reasonable. Somehow software people have forgotten that physical things last a long time, and people want them to keep working and stay the same as long as possible . My thermostat doesn't need "upgrades", and anyone who thinks they are going to…

I wonder if we could wield regulation to discourage products that phone home without also providing the ability to: - install a cert so we can MITM the traffic and see what they're phoning home about - turn off the phoning home without breaking local functionality - configure a different address for cloud I/O, such that I can run the "cloud" part on my own infra if I want those features

Or it could be done like GDPR — requiring consent and explaining what addresses the device will communicate to, what data will be sent, when, and for what purpose. GDPR requires that every purpose of personal data use is consented to and explained the same way — what data is collected, where it is processed, for how long it is retained, and for what purpose. New tech privacy laws could* definitely use something like this as a starting point.

* Assuming no malicious lobbying.

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#227

Post by Larrikin »

stirlo wrote: post #218
Larrikin wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is mostly iOS people that are not used to waterproof phones. Many top quality Android phones have been water resistant for years. My first one was the Sony Xperia Z1 released a decade ago. So, controlling a speaker from your phone in the shower is an obvious solution versus trying to talk to it.

While nearly all phones (including iPhones) have been waterproof for almost decade now that does not solve the issue with capacitive touch screens not working when wet, where to put the phone where it won't slip and break on the tiles, and the terrible quality of phone speakers in general. And then you have a wet slippery phone to put in your pocket (plus probably water trapped behind whatever case you have on it). O…

When you shower, do you just put your clothes on and have no access to a towel?

The first iPhone that claimed to be water resistant was the iPhone 7, which was the first iPhone to remove the headphone jack. Android phones solved water resistance with a headphone jack years before that. It was released in 2016, 3 years after the wave of Android phones that were water resistant. I'm a little surprised that it was that long ago but it also makes me question how water resistant the phones are.

Your contrived use cases in the shower come across as someone who hasn't tried to use their phone in the shower. Cases easily come off, towels exist, shower caddies exist, places where your soap isn't under a constant stream of water exist, and screens work pretty well in the shower if you aren't trying to use it under a direct stream of water in your face. I've personally never seen the feature touted in Apple advertising, so it seems fragile to me. Although I guess the number of stories I hear of people using the bathroom and needing to replace their phone because it fell in the toilet has decreased. My iPhone using friends are usually surprised when I say I regularly use my Sony in the shower.

If the iPhone actually is capable of handling water finally, maybe the screen is just particularly bad with water on it.

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#228

Post by jamiek88 »

the_snooze wrote: post #212
cabalamat wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The new one is digital but isn't "smart". I do not, nor will I ever use, any "smart" device. "Smart" devices are - unnecessarily complicated - privacy destroying - overpriced - vendor lock-in - often infected with online ads you can't get rid of - likely to stop working if the vendor goes bust, their business model changes, or they just feel like it IMO, it is rarely or never a smart decision to get a "smart" devic…

The people who design those things have the exact mindset of an abusive partner: - I want to know everything about you and who you talk to - I will control and change things without your say-so - You can't leave me easily

- but I can leave you whenever I want

- no you can’t know what you need to know to self host when I leave. How dare you think of other vendors that’s basically cheating on me

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#229

Post by clnq »

brookst wrote: post #219
titzer wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Prior to replacing my furnace I had a mercury thermostat that was easily over 50 years old. The new one is digital but isn't "smart". I don't expect 50 years, but 20-30 seems reasonable. Somehow software people have forgotten that physical things last a long time, and people want them to keep working and stay the same as long as possible . My thermostat doesn't need "upgrades", and anyone who thinks they are going to…

> physical things last a long time There's a lot of survivor bias here. I have had plenty of dumb physical things fail in what seems like unreasonably short times. But I do have done physical dumb devices that are 100+ years old. I do not interpret that to mean that everything from that era / factory / manufacturer lasts 100 years, just that all of the surviving items did.

Reliability of anything can be described by the same generic bathtub curve — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bathtub_curve. We used to have a lot of technology that would wear out very slowly, but early failure was more common. Now most technology doesn't last more than a year or two, but generally doesn't fail upfront.

Re: I'm never investing in Google's smart home ecosystem again

#230

Post by freen »

briHass wrote: post #93
zamalek wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use Google devices with my HA setup just fine (although I want to move away). HA just added integrated assistant support, so I'm keen to try that out when I get back from vacation.

Does the HA voice assistant support require HA Cloud or whatever they're calling it? The price for that $6/m felt a bit steep for what it provided, though supporting HA development is appealing. When I started to read through the non-cloud option, I saw some analog telephone and POTS modem requirements and my eyes glazed over.

Nope. As far as I know, everything can be run locally, given a sufficiently powerful machine.
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