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MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

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Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#441

Post by lxgr »

hospitalJail wrote: post #391

When trying to get GPT Bing, I let Microsoft set the defaults like they insisted. It was such an awful experience. >desktop ads >Edge opens, edge ads >Bing default browser, ads >start menu ads More on their products: >Sharepoint, 3 different versions, terrible documentation. Impossible to develop for when you have forum posts describing different software with the same name. >Power Automate, No I don't want drag and…

I also recently installed Edge (on macOS) to give BinGPT a try and almost couldn't believe what I saw. Ads, coupons, rewards everywhere...

It truly felt like being transported to the darkest times of the late 90s/early 2000s, with multiple adware toolbars cluttering the IE user interface.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#442

Post by sleepybrett »

marginalia_nu wrote: post #50
peoplefromibiza wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Anti-competitive behaviour runs deep in ~~Microsoft~~ rampant capitalism, especially in the US of A the end goal is always to become a monopolist

Well on paper at least, the US has antitrust laws going back to the Sherman Act and Standard Oil. Microsoft was basically inches away from being broken up in the late '90s due to their anti-competitive practices.

They absolutely should have been and if they were we probably wouldn't have the amazon or google we have today.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#443

Post by user3939382 »

manuelabeledo wrote: post #418
user3939382 wrote: post #413

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does because if you test your policies and scripts it shouldn't be broken. None of this negates the fact that we shouldn't have to be writing hacks to counteract MS's dark pattern games in the first place.

> It does because if you test your policies and scripts it shouldn't be broken. Removing Edge, like the previous poster suggested, does break certain features. Also, you seem to suggest that standard Windows deployments are permanently and continuously idempotent, but they definitely are not. The play is clear. Since this is a potential risky move, very few IT admins will try to remove Edge in the first place.

> Windows deployments are permanently and continuously idempotent, but they definitely are not.

They can be. I've administered large networks personally where they are. If the GP comment would break something that's different, I agree. I'm commenting in the abstract, it is definitely possible to remove files or change the registry at scale. Windows is very good at that.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#444

Post by sleepybrett »

roydivision wrote: post #129
jarym wrote: post #108

IT admins have only themselves to blame for choosing Teams in the first place. Yes, it is included in O365 and it makes it a no-brainer as far as additional costs and things go. But then there's the risk that Microsoft leverage their captive and lazy market to foist other undesirable things on users... like this. And crappy news / adverts in Windows 11's 'start menu' replacement. Ready to get voted down on this, but…

In my experience, in any company larger than 500 people at least, the IT admin has little say in the matter. These sorts of decisions are taken higher up, and the admin just has to live with it.

Free with your fucking enterprise windows license vs pay slack is pretty fucking convincing to the c-suite.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#445

Post by TheCoelacanth »

Avamander wrote: post #196
malermeister wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use a Firefox addon that spoofs the user agent for Google-owned sites so it delivers the Chrome version of things. Works without any issues and it's a much nicer product experience.

I'm not trying to excuse Google, but feature detection is really hard and browsers sometimes suck with their APIs. I just recently started using a modified version of the "h265ify" add-on that just advertises support of a few extra codecs (HEVC and surprisingly MPEG-2) to websites. With both Edge and Chrome, I do that because I know the formats work but the API doesn't indicate they do.

Everything is hard if you don't want to do it.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#446

Post by inetknght »

alberth wrote: post #432
snoopen wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's absolutely the right framing. This isn't a setting that allows admins to force a browser for security. This is obviously about MS trying to force the uptake of Edge and nothing more.

Let's compare this to Google Workspace. Google Workspace functionality is only fully supports Google Chrome. Google Workspace doesn't support a number of key features on Firefox, Safari & Edge - as denoted below. https://support.google.com/a/answer/33864?hl=en So how is what Microsoft is doing, different? They are only fully supporting Microsoft Edge (much like how Google only supports their own browser)

> Let's compare this to Google Workspace.

Well, Google Workspace is a dumpster fire. Anything that I can't run offline is a dumpster fire. That's a hill I'm willing to die on.

> Google Workspace functionality is only fully supports Google Chrome.

That's by Google's "choice". It's definitely not a technical decision.

> Google Workspace doesn't support a number of key features on Firefox, Safari & Edge - as denoted below. https://support.google.com/a/answer/33864?hl=en

I can tell you from personal experience that the only reason Google Workspace doesn't "work" on Firefox is because of user-agent sniffing and similar countermeasures deployed by Google. There's absolutely no technical reason that the disabled features cannot work on Firefox.

> So how is what Microsoft is doing, different?

It's in fact not.

> They are only fully supporting Microsoft Edge (much like how Google only supports their own browser)

No, they are only fully permitting Microsoft Edge (much like how Google only fully permits their own browser).

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#447

Post by zimpenfish »

NikolaNovak wrote: post #382
kitsunesoba wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I can install any keyboard I want as long as it's just a skin on their keyboard. As an iOS app dev with a hobby project iOS keyboard, this is false. Third party iOS keyboards have just as much control over the keyboard UI and how each key (if it even has keys — your “keyboard” can be literally anything) interacts with text as a full fledged app does. In fact there is no way to “skin” the standard keyboard, but I wi…

I'm extremely interested in this; how come none of the keyboards I've tried depart from the same layout as Apple? Is it strict adherence to guidelines rather than technical restriction then? To wit, some of the features that same-named apps/keyboards give me on android but not on iPhone include "hold key for alternative character" or button to "force" numpad. As well all keyboards I've tried have same layout and sizi…

I have MessageEase installed as a keyboard.

https://www.exideas.com/ME/index.php

Somewhat different from the original keyboard layout.

(The paucity of alternatives is probably down to patents and licensing.)

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#449

Post by makeitdouble »

dathinab wrote: post #178

So anyone still thinking MS is now all good and it's not an issue that it own github + vscode + a endless list of other things relevant for especially smaller development companies? Microsoft will do whats best for them. Temporary this includes embrace open source to some degree and being reasonable nice to Linux. For example WSL can help with trying out Linux and help cross platform devs on Windows to develop for Li…

I think this is down to the usual issue: what are you willing to give up in exchange for linux ?

A decade ago you'd need to give up high DPI screens and capable laptops for linux. Today it's either the mac ecosystem with the iOS dev tools, or the Windows compatible newer form factors and/or the games/VR ecosystem.

Apple will do what helps Apple, and Microsoft will do what serves Microsoft. Does a pure linux experience effectively serve you in your day to day work ? If yes, lucky you, it's still "no" fo many of us.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#450

Post by azangru »

LeifCarrotson wrote: post #203
capableweb wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile they want to be to its competitors and users, because two people can play this game. I don't get Microsoft, have they no pride or desire to become a great company? Have they just become content to be an old corporate software house who only manages to keep users through dark patterns and anti-competitive behaviour because they have given up on making products which people e…

> You're talking about this like Microsoft ever did anything differently than what you wrote? Since when have they focused 100% on just building great products and competing fairly? They did a wonderful job with C# and .NET Core. But you need to remember your org charts; the Edge and Windows 11 decision-makers are not the same people with the same incentives.

> They did a wonderful job with C# and .NET Core.

And typescript!

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