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MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

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Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#131

Post by rhamzeh »

wkat4242 wrote: post #102
dustedcodes wrote: post #6

I have no skin in the game, but even I am starting to think the obvious thing here: Apple and Google own the entire mobile OS market. They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft. But they don't. So far they were competing by making their own products better. Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile…

Apple and Google own the mobile market together. There's not one player that owns almost all of it like that did with Windows (and still do really). One is a healthy market, the other is not. And Android respects browser choice, iOS will soon be forced to in the EU with the new sideloading mandate.

Both monopolies and duopolies are unhealthy, the only reason they're acting better in Europe because, as you said, they are being forced to.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#132

Post by hdjjhhvvhga »

modo_mario wrote: post #19
dustedcodes wrote: post #6

I have no skin in the game, but even I am starting to think the obvious thing here: Apple and Google own the entire mobile OS market. They could literally destroy Microsoft if they started to hugely degrade the experience of Microsoft products on iOS and Android with dark patterns a la Microsoft. But they don't. So far they were competing by making their own products better. Microsoft needs to think hard how hostile…

>Have they just become Were they ever different tho? I know a lot of people believed the 'MS loves open source' and similar stuff but it always felt like bait to me. They still tried to force trough their shitty open document format, still regularly pull layers of small anticompetitive stuff. Small changes that aren't outrageous enough on their own to cause a reaction or throw out the trust they try to create but eno…

> Were they ever different tho?

According to many people on HN, they changed completely, and they have nothing to do with the old epoch of Ballmer and Gates. Yet, I was never convinced by the "but they embrace open source now" argument:

* their financing of SCO in the "Linux is illegal" ridiculous attempt to discredit their competition that took over a decade

* the contempt for their users in various ways, from gray patterns with local vs MS accounts to ads in the start menu and other spyware with settings that reset after random upgrades to "defaults" convenient only for MS

* if they profess so much love for Linux and spend so much on kernel development (actually, that's mostly for Hyper-V etc.), why they don't do one simple thing and recognize Linux as a Desktop OS that you can install along Windows? Instead, in 2023 you have to still install Windows first to avoid problems. Linux doesn't have this problem and will recognize an existing Windows installation and will even add it to its boot menu.

Plus one million other tricks they played that shows the changes are just superficial.

*

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#133

Post by can16358p »

chakintosh wrote: post #3

Microsoft is shoving their software down people's throats with impunity. Just yesterday I had to install VS Code for a Homebridge integration, and out of nowhere they slapped a Bing search bar bang in the middle of the desktop.

I hate Microsoft though I highly doubt that the Bing search bar came from a Vscode installation.

Are you sure it is the case?

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#135

Post by thih9 »

> To help increase productivity while working online, web links from Azure Active Directory (AAD) accounts and Microsoft (MSA) accounts in the Outlook for Windows app will open in Microsoft Edge in a single view showing the opened link side-by-side with the email it came from.

What is single view? Does anyone have a screenshot or a screencast of that UX in action?

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#136

Post by aitchnyu »

IceWreck wrote: post #34
3np wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to give Microsoft an out here but really? The equivalent for this on iOS or Android would be allowing opening links in a different browser and web view engine. The equivalent Microsoft apps on mobile OSs aren't degraded - they aren't even allowed to exist in the first place. Microsoft is bringing the desktop experience in line with mobile here. Doesn't make it less terrible but contrasting Apple and Google as bet…

Microsoft apps exist on Android and they're not forced to open links in Chrome on Android. If the user chooses, they can open on Microsoft Edge on Android. The user can set their own browser preference - and Google doesn't force them. Apple doesn't allow other browser engines but it's on them. None of these bug tech corps are in the right here, but MS is being more anti-competitive than most.

Umm, MS Teams on Adroid forced me to install Edge to open links. Even the copy action pushes "haha, we wont give away this link you moron" (in corp speak) to the clipboard.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#137

Post by reaperducer »

e12e wrote: post #120

This is an expected normalization of html email and the mostly-client-side-apps; Outlook (the desktop app) already renders the html email in a MS rendering engine (Edge? I don't know). If the email has a button (or a link) - i think it makes sense that the click event shows up "in" the mail client. I hate html email - but the last 20 years have been all about siloing hypertext apps in email systems - proprietary prot…

This is an expected normalization of html email

I have two Macs running Microsoft Outlook. One is running a version several years behind the current one.

The old machine can send e-mail as plain text. The one running the current Microsoft Outlook doesn't have that option, or a way to enable it that I've been able to find.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#138

Post by zelphirkalt »

npteljes wrote: post #119
lifty wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any usability difference between the two?

VS Codium and other forks don't (maybe can't) use the official VSCode extension market. Because a lot of goodness, like the ability to refactor and debug PHP, is coming from the extensions and the extension ecosystem, it can be a big deal.

However, one can still add that marketplace, if one wants to do so. So people could still have access to the same extensions (which might be a privacy and telemetry or spyware risk), but at least not have the in-built telemetry.

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#139

Post by blazespin »

Pulz wrote: post #57

I'm an IT Admin with 15+ sites across my country. I'm not angry about this change. Myself and most of the people I've networked with either have or are transitioning away from other browsers, towards Edge. As a browser, it's fine. It has good PDF viewing/editing features, performant and works well with organisational SSO.

Yeah, unless you're a shop running outlook and teams, not sure you really have a say here. Maybe this is what customers want.

Also, not entirely clear that verge isn't just knee jerk reporting. Any sys admins that have actual first hand experience with this and can confirm?

Re: MSFT is forcing Outlook and Teams to open links in Edge and IT admins are angry

#140

Post by buran77 »

AraceliHarker wrote: post #86
toyg wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft is actually the one reacting here. They were effectively forced to let the web be an open field by antitrust cases; Apple and Google took advantage of that to build two walled gardens, which ended up dwarfing MS's own empire. It was inevitable that, sooner or later, MS would have gone "If this behaviour is now allowed, why should we not do it too?" This is just the result of normalizing monopolistic practic…

Simply put, people don't love Edge as much as they love Chrome. The browser bundled with Windows 11 is naturally Edge, but users who use Chrome install Chrome of their own volition, so forcing them to open links in Edge is extremely annoying.

I doubt "love" for the software is involved here. I think many users believe Chrome is "the internet" just like they used to believe the Google search page was the internet, or Internet Explorer before that. This impression of Chrome was built on the fact that it's a solid browser but was enforced by Google with the same underhanded practices they applied for years.

My Android phone came with Chrome which I can't uninstall, just disable. Chrome is just there on millions of mobile devices, it was already on millions of PCs and has been for years, so people are used to that. The synergies between those devices and the Google services services makes it easy to stay and hard to leave.

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