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U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

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Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#141

Post by sandworm101 »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #134
sandworm101 wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every community meeting, every political rally, where crime is used as a wedge. Every pundit who says that person X is "soft" on crime and person Y is "hard" as if that makes any difference. Every idiot out there who wants drug dealers locked up for life yet is unable to address their own addition to prescriptions. Every armchair lawyer who will spend hours outlining how judges should rule on hypothetical cases, but…

> community meeting, every political rally, where crime is used as a wedge Have you been to these? I have, in states red and blue. It's rarely a rah rah. Instead, people have complaints about specific categories of crimes, usually ones relevant to the community. The question is less locking people up than catching them. Policing. Sentencing is a separate system from policing.

>> Sentencing is a separate system from policing.

Again, not in reality. Absent unlimited resources, street-level police determine which crimes are "policed" based on the severity of associated punishments. Change the punishment for drug dealing from a prison sentence to a minor fine and police will all but stop hunting drug dealers. Start sentencing jaywalkers to prison time and you will see cops at every pedestrian crossing. Sentencing is the guide by which police determine which laws the public most wants to see enforced.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#142

Post by woodruffw »

catiopatio wrote: post #130
Arainach wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. Having done a minor in criminal justice, officers, lawmakers, and others involved in the justice system could absolutely benefit from exposure to sociology and academic CJ. The American "justice" system is a travesty and continues following methods that we've known not to work for many decades. To fix the system we need the folks inside it to understand the system. Part of that is education. Part of that…

Hiring people from a sociology/social justice background would just mean the same abuses of power, but different targets. Policing has gone in this direction in the UK, and now you have mothers being arrested in front of their children after “misgendering” someone online: https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/i-stand-with-kate-scotto... > St Albans Magistrates’ Court found her guilty, under the Communications Act (2003…

Americans are normally the ones to myopically reduce the world's issues to their own, but sometimes the British are not to be bested!

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#143

Post by AlbertCory »

fourseventy wrote: post #64
bell-cot wrote: post #9

I've never heard any justification for having "college education" as a job requirement. Or at least no justification that didn't amount to "keep out people who aren't like us", or "pretend to be competent", or "posture as exclusive".

Do you want a Dr operating on you who didn't graduate from college or medical school? There is a reason why degrees are requirements.

Do you not want an EMT who didn't go to college keeping you alive in the ambulance, until the real doctor at the hospital gets to look at you?

You'd rather die? OK, your choice.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#144

Post by ubermonkey »

babelthuap wrote: post #3

[flagged]

You're wrong about the Presidency.

The Constitution explicitly states that he or she must be a natural-born citizen of the United States; naturalization won't do. State election boards generally take the word of the political parties, but as has been shown in recent years eligibility can be challenged in court -- most often by racist shitheels upset about the skin tone of the candidate in question.

A qualifying birth certificate is usually the path taken here.

So yeah, you don't have to show it unless challenged, but if you can't show it you likely WILL be challenged, and that could be a problem.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#145

Post by HideousKojima »

triceratops wrote: post #121
efitz wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obama of course was born in Hawaii and of course he was a US citizen. That said, the law at the time was that if your father wasn’t a citizen, then your mother had to be a citizen AND had to have been living in the US for the previous 5 years. Dumb law IMO but it was the law and was raised by a lot of birthers.

It's not possible for Obama's mother to have been living outside the US 5 years before his birth. She only met Obama Sr 2 years before little Barack was born. (Not that facts or logic matter to birthers, but anyway)

>It's not possible for Obama's mother to have been living outside the US 5 years before his birth.

I think you misread the law, if she lived outside the country for two years then she wouldn't have spent the last five years in the US.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#146

Post by dopeboy »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #34

I appreciate the gesture but let's be real here. It's not like the requirement ever mattered. Just like a white house internship, nobody was getting a job as a congressional staffer without a recommendation from someone worth listening to.

Former congressional intern and WH intern (and later WH staff) here - it's possible to get those internships without a recommendation from someone worth listening to. I would go so far as to say it's mildly common.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#147

Post by whitemary »

version_five wrote: post #2

Sort of related, ontario is dropping university requirements for police: https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/ontario-eliminating-edu... I wonder if it's coincidence or the start of a trend back to sanity about job qualifications. Ironically, by becoming almost ubiquitous, university education also becomes irrelevant.

It's a trend towards lower wages. That's all.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#148

Post by gnicholas »

This is really great. I've been talking with friends who have high schoolers, and it's clear that the college preparation and application process is incredibly stressful, time-consuming, and expensive. And that's for the kids who are a reasonably good fit for college, and who have supportive parents.

But so much of the market value of a college degree is in the signaling (just showing you were smart enough to get in) that it doesn't make sense to spend all this time, money, and heartache on this process. It's an arms-race dilemma for students and families, so it's hard to opt out of. But the more employers that move in this direction, the better things will be for lots of kids, and families.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#149

Post by version_five »

PakG1 wrote: post #135
version_five wrote: post #2

Sort of related, ontario is dropping university requirements for police: https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/ontario-eliminating-edu... I wonder if it's coincidence or the start of a trend back to sanity about job qualifications. Ironically, by becoming almost ubiquitous, university education also becomes irrelevant.

I don't need police to be highly educated necessarily. I do need police to be psychologically balanced and show calm restraint. Is there a way we can put that in the job requirements and use it as hiring criteria?

I'd say that's part initial screening, part training, and part willingness to fire people that turn out to be unsuitable. All of that is helped by having access to a broader candidate pool, such as by not imposing arbitrary education requirements.

Something related that's often discussed in law enforcement and military is the idea of being able to hire directly into some upper specialist positions without the person having to rise through the ranks. This is sort of the opposite, admitting that some senior positions do not need an arbitrary field experience requirement. In both cases, it's about better matching the requirements and subsequent training and career progression to what's actually needed for the job. This kind of rationalization is the upside of a tight labor market.

Re: U.S. Rep. Angie Craig drops college requirement for staffers

#150

Post by ngngngng »

PakG1 wrote: post #135
version_five wrote: post #2

Sort of related, ontario is dropping university requirements for police: https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/ontario-eliminating-edu... I wonder if it's coincidence or the start of a trend back to sanity about job qualifications. Ironically, by becoming almost ubiquitous, university education also becomes irrelevant.

I don't need police to be highly educated necessarily. I do need police to be psychologically balanced and show calm restraint. Is there a way we can put that in the job requirements and use it as hiring criteria?

Have you ever had interactions with police? Did you find them psychologically balanced?
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