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Russia killed its tech industry

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Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#121

Post by ivan_gammel »

yostrovs wrote: post #77
thriftwy wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder if there are any specific examples of Russian culture that are preserved outside Russia but lost inside Russia. Russia 30 years ago was a failed and miserable state with corresponding words choice. In the modern Russia not many actual people watch TV.

Russian food, language, and religion are better preserved by Russian communities outside Russia. Immigrants that left in 1990s as adults speak purer Russian than TV news people.

“Preserved” in the original state, like in museum - yes. Russian communities outside Russia rarely contributed anything new to it. Russian culture actively developed in last 30 years, against all odds and efforts of the state, which coincidentally wanted to freeze it or roll back in time too.

Russian language indeed borrowed a few words, but this is not a bad thing, it’s a common reflection of Zeitgeist that happened to the language before.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#122

Post by tiahura »

denton-scratch wrote: post #61
ajuc wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enough to defend. Not enough to win decisively. Timing matters. If EU and USA provided the help that they did but in the first 6 months - Ukraine would have already won. But the help is drip-fed to Ukraine, supposedly to "not escalate". The result is that the war that could be already over is dragging on, and eventually people will stop helping for one reason or another. If we want a quick win for Ukraine we should s…

> Not enough to win decisively. It's often claimed that US policy is to take advantage of the war to grind down Russian military capability, and that the USA will fight to the last Ukrainian. I must say, I find the reluctance to supply missiles that could be used to hit targets inside Russia seems to support that view. I mean, it's not as if Russia is hitting targets inside Ukraine, is it? /s It's completely normal i…

The Sec of Defense has said this several times. The primary goal is to degrade Russia’s war fighting capability so that it is no longer a threat to its other neighbors.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#123

Post by tim333 »

pseg134 wrote: post #55
qumpis wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this a joke in Russia, i.e. people referring to him as black in order to lessen the view of Russia's outlook to foreigners? I've never heard people refer to Pushkin as being black (and his parents indeed aren't), besides his great grandfather.

I guess you can tell us the percentage of someone’s blood that has to be black for them to be black. What is the percentage?

The South Africans used to have a colour chart.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#124

Post by yostrovs »

ivan_gammel wrote: post #121
yostrovs wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Russian food, language, and religion are better preserved by Russian communities outside Russia. Immigrants that left in 1990s as adults speak purer Russian than TV news people.

“Preserved” in the original state, like in museum - yes. Russian communities outside Russia rarely contributed anything new to it. Russian culture actively developed in last 30 years, against all odds and efforts of the state, which coincidentally wanted to freeze it or roll back in time too. Russian language indeed borrowed a few words, but this is not a bad thing, it’s a common reflection of Zeitgeist that happened…

Russians outside Russia for the last 100 years have contributed literature, music, movies, and helped to introduce Russian cultural aspects to the West. In the past 30 years this only accelerated. Even before this war there were huge numbers of Russian intellectuals, artists, etc living in the West, but contributing to Russian culture.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#125

Post by nefreat »

asats wrote: post #107
yogthos wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, half of those achievements are just rocket science. Seethe and cope harder.

I'm not downplaying the achievements, I'm saying they could've been a lot greater if the system didn't try to mutilate and murder it's author.

You're right it could've been a lot greater however you should apply the same analysis towards the USA as well.

If you're black you're all but barred from participating in the space program. This was only recently acknowledged in a Hollywood feel good movie: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hidden_Figures

The space program was bootstrapped by Nazis: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Paperclip

I'm saying they achievements could've been a lot greater if the system didn't try to mutilate and murder it's subjects: https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/history/40-years-human-exp...

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#126

Post by hdjjhhvvhga »

ghostwriter wrote: post #120
asats wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's what I mean, a million of the 20-40 age group of a certain socioeconomic class, with relevant skills, a lot of ambition and not many dependents. Those are the exact group to start new things and do a lot of good, and my point was that maybe the world is better off with them in the more productive countries vs even the pre-war Russia.

You’re conflating a group of pro-western enterprise software developers - with little to no adulthood responsibilities aside their work, due to their age - with a group of the brightest folks.

> pro-western

What does being pro- or anti-West has to do with the topic? There are many Russian expats in Germany who openly manifest their support for Putin's war on the streets of Berlin. You can be anti-Western and at the same time pragmatically leave Russia to avoid draft and being killed for basically no reason.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#127

Post by koonsolo »

ajuc wrote: post #41
phillipcarter wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They are yet to be proved wrong. I'm confused. Hasn't the US and EU given incredible military aide to Ukraine?

Enough to defend. Not enough to win decisively. Timing matters. If EU and USA provided the help that they did but in the first 6 months - Ukraine would have already won. But the help is drip-fed to Ukraine, supposedly to "not escalate". The result is that the war that could be already over is dragging on, and eventually people will stop helping for one reason or another. If we want a quick win for Ukraine we should s…

You are wrong about your military assessment.

A quick win would mean Russia would hold on to a lot of military resources. By providing Ukraine just enough to deny Russia any wins, and Russia stupid enough to not pull out, they are basically draining Russia to death.

Right now Russia is sending T-54's to the battlefield. Their 'storm the front' tactics is killing their soldiers at a crazy rate.

Now this is the military standpoint, there is also a humanitarian side. Now on the humanitarian side, I agree a quick win would be better and save a lot of lives. I'm a proponent for NATO to control the skies, at least West from the Dnipro river.

But claiming it's a military failure on the Western side is just plain wrong. This right now is NATO's ideal military scenario.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#128

Post by asats »

ghostwriter wrote: post #120
asats wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's what I mean, a million of the 20-40 age group of a certain socioeconomic class, with relevant skills, a lot of ambition and not many dependents. Those are the exact group to start new things and do a lot of good, and my point was that maybe the world is better off with them in the more productive countries vs even the pre-war Russia.

You’re conflating a group of pro-western enterprise software developers - with little to no adulthood responsibilities aside their work, due to their age - with a group of the brightest folks.

Software developers make up maybe a third of that wave, if that. There's also artists, scientists, teachers, journalists, political activists and all kinds of other folks that simply don't see the future in the country. A lot of them are families with kids, so it's often not the lack of responsibilities but a higher willingness to take the risk.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#129

Post by ivan_gammel »

ghostwriter wrote: post #120
asats wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, that's what I mean, a million of the 20-40 age group of a certain socioeconomic class, with relevant skills, a lot of ambition and not many dependents. Those are the exact group to start new things and do a lot of good, and my point was that maybe the world is better off with them in the more productive countries vs even the pre-war Russia.

You’re conflating a group of pro-western enterprise software developers - with little to no adulthood responsibilities aside their work, due to their age - with a group of the brightest folks.

People who left the country are not just software developers. We have seen the exodus of musicians, scientists etc, which after some very painful decision process just packed their things and took next flight anywhere. Many took their families.

Re: Russia killed its tech industry

#130

Post by Paradigma11 »

imsointeresting wrote: post #73
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #13

I find it heartbreaking. I grew up in the Cold War (my father was in the CIA). Russians were considered brutish, non-creative, and untrustworthy. Then, the Berlin Wall came down, and everything changed. I started to see amazing creativity come from Russia. Music, technology, art, actors, dance, all kinds of stuff. I loved working with Russian engineers. They were some of the best techs I'd worked with. I have a lot o…

That political opposition has a very high opinion of themselves. Despite the gloomy predictions, Russia keeps doing fine on all dimensions. War in Ukraine was not a good thing to happen, but Russia is not that badly managed, and the West is not that well managed.

Last quarter: -45% oil and gas revenue. $29 Billion deficit. Ruble losing ~1/3 its value. GDP is still doing somewhat fine with that booming war economy. I guess all those white ladas have to be build somewhere.
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