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iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

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Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#381

Post by wiseowise »

simondotau wrote: post #112
pseudo0 wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So take five minutes to set up the parental controls on your children's devices. The idea that we should eliminate the ability to run arbitrary software "for the children" is completely ridiculous.

Then don’t buy an iPhone. I think it’s ridiculous that we are asking the government to save us from our own choices. As much as you and I don’t like it, what Apple is doing is perfectly legal. And as much as you or I might support a change in the law, you’re not going to get my support if the legislation is truly universal and not just a narrow-band targeting of a single company for developing an ecosystem which reso…

> Then don’t buy an iPhone. I think it’s ridiculous that we are asking the government to save us from our own choices.

That's a great argument. I have even a better one:

Don't dictate what and how people use their devices that they paid for with their hard-earned money.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#382

Post by 76SlashDolphin »

charcircuit wrote: post #38
superkuh wrote: post #14

Even if this is small progress the headlines and framing of the story are still doublespeak. Installing applications on your computer is the normal state of things. Walled gardens and not having control of your computer is the new weird thing. The word "sideloading" is a feudal concept and it's unquestioned use is dangerous for society. Properly stated this story title is, "Installing applications on iOS 17 might be…

>Installing applications on your computer is the normal state of things. It really wasn't. It wasn't normal to install arbitrary applications on the computers in your fridge, dishwasher, game consoles, flip phones, washing machines, etc. Platforms have varied over time in how open they are to having other people developing for them. iOS is an example of a more closed platform and has shown that closed platforms can b…

The question is which of these is a general purpose computer and which isn't. IMHO if what people tend to do on a platform is the same as what they do on a PC then that platform should also be forced to be a general-purposed computer and allow (in some roundabout way) arbitrary application installation.

For example, a smartphone replaces a PC for a lot of people. I even know some people in their 20s that don't own a "normal" laptop/desktop and they do most of their general purpose computing on their phones. In the meantime, nobody uses a Nintendo Switch or their dishwasher to do a quick edit of an excel sheet or access their bank account even if they are technically capable of doing so.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#383

Post by ko27 »

zacksiri wrote: post #242

[flagged]

Is anybody else upset that people are actively making up stories to prop up Apple on HN? Most of what you said is misleading or false:

> Here in Thailand banking apps fraud is rampant

Citation needed (on the "rampant" part).

> Most of the cases are found to be on android devices

Even if it's true most of the phones in Thailand are Android.

> clicking some link that installs some app

Not possible the way you describe it. You need to go through several system screens and popups to install a third party apk file from browser.

> takes control or mobile banking and transfers money from their account

As an app developer I can say, this is probably false. There is no API to do anything like that. Unless we are talking about a 0 day exploit, like iPhone NSO exploits. In that case you need to provide a source.

Let's check your source https://www.nationthailand.com/thailand/general/40024972

They are sending detailed instructions to victims on how to install screen recording apps. Users are always warned if their screen is being recorded on both Android and iOS, sideloaded or not. It's a matter of false trust, not sideloading. It's a phishing attack, those people would fall victim in any OS.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#384

Post by sbuk »

anonzzzies wrote: post #356
fortuna86 wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard this, I haven't seen this. Maybe a smart phone was a status symbol 10 years ago, they are just commodities today.

I do recognise it; large iPhones and Apple Watches are still about twice the price of the competitor. And people with Android phones are considered poor here.

Where is "here"? Wouldn't you say that any party making those sorts of judgements (iPhone users are sheep/Android users are poor) aren't worth listening to? Isn't that more of a reflection of "here's" culture than the individuals choice? Is it not that an individuals choice to buy something is more than just a cost decision?

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#385

Post by realusername »

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #228
realusername wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No study managed to prove a loss of revenue with piracy, you are not going to be the first app in the world to experience it.

https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3577670

I see nothing in this paper which is proving their claim. The worst part is when they talk about the drop of CD sales pre-streaming where the legal options to consume music online ... just didn't exist at all.

If there's no legal option where your customers can pay you, that sure can lead to a revenue drop.

The music industries have been very slow to adapt to the internet and it has cost them some revenue, I'll give you that but that has nothing to do with piracy.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#387

Post by xorcist »

jpalomaki wrote: post #180

I think Apple has also done good things with their strict app store policies (from my consumer point of view). Apple has been for example putting limits on data collection and tracking. The main mechanism is to kick apps out from Apps store if they don't play by the rules. I'm worried that side loading will be a step back here. Strong players, like Facebook, may just take their app away from the official store and di…

> putting limits on data collection and tracking

You know who's really putting limits on data collecting? F-Droid.

If that's actually your argument, that's what you should use. It's quite practical.

> Strong players, like Facebook, may just take their app away from the official

That argument really has to explain why this has not happened on every other operating system under the sun, including Android. They all suffer pretty strong monopolistic network effects.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#388

Post by jeroenhd »

amelius wrote: post #316
toyg wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is law and there is the spirit of the law. The ECJ can be pretty fast when they feel someone is taking the piss.

The cookie popups can be very annoying and confusing and they didn't do anything about that.

They have actually fined several large tracking providers for their shady cookie popups because opting out was harder than opting in.

European DPAs aren't getting enough funding to take on this problem, but they haven't been sitting still either.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#389

Post by wiseowise »

charcircuit wrote: post #38
superkuh wrote: post #14

Even if this is small progress the headlines and framing of the story are still doublespeak. Installing applications on your computer is the normal state of things. Walled gardens and not having control of your computer is the new weird thing. The word "sideloading" is a feudal concept and it's unquestioned use is dangerous for society. Properly stated this story title is, "Installing applications on iOS 17 might be…

>Installing applications on your computer is the normal state of things. It really wasn't. It wasn't normal to install arbitrary applications on the computers in your fridge, dishwasher, game consoles, flip phones, washing machines, etc. Platforms have varied over time in how open they are to having other people developing for them. iOS is an example of a more closed platform and has shown that closed platforms can b…

> iOS is an example of a more closed platform and has shown that closed platforms can be successful.

It is successful despite being closed, not because of it.

Re: iOS 17 app sideloading might only be available in Europe

#390

Post by peoplefromibiza »

anomaly_ wrote: post #380

Wall Europe off and let them suffer their government regulated mobile phone. Anyone cheering this has a short memory.

that's a textbook example of a punishment that in reality is a long awaited gift.

Edit: funny that people on HN, that should be smart enough to know about the World, imagine that everything that it's not from the USA must be automatically coming from Stalin.

Like no other place in the World has industries, it's either US products or the government making stuff.

If Apple stops selling devices in Europe I will celebrate, for us Europeans that's the opposite of something we are worried about.

We'll buy them from Samsung or some Chinese manufacturer, who cares.

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