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Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

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Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#41

Having escaped Australia during the middle of the pandemic, I'd like to correct this article: Australia's only long-haul carrier during the pandemic was United. Thanks United for getting me out of Australia!

Qantas was operating repatriation flights back to Australia during the pandemic on behalf of DFAT.

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#42

It's a magnificent plane. It's very unfortunate that they launched the "shortened" version. The design and engineering was done for longer fuselage, so it actually has extra structure (and extra weight!) and larger wings than necessary. And it launched just before engines got a lot more efficient. The upside for passengers is that it's still the smoothest flying experience, even in turbulence. Boeing's 747 was incred…

The A380 is pretty smooth, but I found that the way it cruises is not great for me. It tends to surge and glide in a way that prevents me from actually falling asleep, more so than on other smaller planes like a 787. While the 787 might not be as silky smooth taking off and landing, I prefer it for the long term comfort that matters for most of the flight.

Is this how pilots are taught to operate it? Or how the engines automatically operate when the pilot is throttling "smoothly".

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#43
post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let's not get too carried away, shall we? At least the 346 people that died in the two 737-MAX crashes would probably question your "unqualified success" statement. But yes, no one can deny that the 737 has been a cash cow for Boeing (for far too long, some would say).

The 737 Max has almost nothing to do with the 737. Don't conflate the two.

The 737 MAX is certified on the same type certificate as the 737 NG, 737 Classic, and 737 Jurassic. Structurally and systematically, they are nearly identical. The only major changes are new flight deck instrumentation, new engines and engine installation, new wingtips, and a re-lofted tailcone.

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> demand for flying is higher than ever Is it ? Trafic is close to prependemic but still below. > The industry is now just about 15% below 2019 levels of demand [0] [0] https://www.iata.org/en/pressroom/2023-releases/2023-04-04-0...

You can tell demand is high because ticket prices are very high. Airlines have opted and are opting to fly fewer planes with higher ticket prices. It's a price over volume optimisation that seems to be in fashion in many industry segments. [0] I will note that some airlines have been affected very badly by issues with rebuilding staffing in ancillary services like luggage and airport security. That uncertainty I thin…

The causes you propose may be true but don’t respond to “higher than never”. I’ll add to your note the not-totaly-solved risk of petroleum not being infinite and while the industry is not freaking out, it has started to questioning itself.

I can buy “prices are very hight” but how would you measure that ? Also did you took inflation into account in your estimation ? Flight “recovery” is largely due to Asian market booming, so prices may go up in the US while decreasing in the biggest market share.

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#46

It's a magnificent plane. It's very unfortunate that they launched the "shortened" version. The design and engineering was done for longer fuselage, so it actually has extra structure (and extra weight!) and larger wings than necessary. And it launched just before engines got a lot more efficient. The upside for passengers is that it's still the smoothest flying experience, even in turbulence. Boeing's 747 was incred…

The A380 was Airbus trying to out-American the Americans, by being the biggest plane, and by betting big on mega-hubs like Dubai, Heathrow, and LAX. There was a great paper that argued that Airbus could only do so because the risk of the decision was mitigated by government launch aid. Airbus's view of the market was wrong, and instead, we have the rise of more city pairs. Not small cities certainly - but right now,…

I'm not convinced that those airports being busiest is relevant here. Presumably most of the volume is domestic traffic, which was never going to be the A380s wheelhouse anyway.

Or maybe that's what you mean, and that Airbus has lost domestic US carrier sales by focusing on the A380? But they've presumably won long haul international sales- Emirates, Singpaore, etc

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#47
post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The A380 is pretty smooth, but I found that the way it cruises is not great for me. It tends to surge and glide in a way that prevents me from actually falling asleep, more so than on other smaller planes like a 787. While the 787 might not be as silky smooth taking off and landing, I prefer it for the long term comfort that matters for most of the flight.

Is this how pilots are taught to operate it? Or how the engines automatically operate when the pilot is throttling "smoothly".

The pilot is not flying the plane at cruise, the autopilot is.

The autopilot can definitely have an effect on how smooth the flying feels, depending on how autothrottle and altitude hold control loops are implemented.

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 737 Max has almost nothing to do with the 737. Don't conflate the two.

The 737 MAX is certified on the same type certificate as the 737 NG, 737 Classic, and 737 Jurassic. Structurally and systematically, they are nearly identical. The only major changes are new flight deck instrumentation, new engines and engine installation, new wingtips, and a re-lofted tailcone.

And those engines played a significant role in the problems.

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#49

It's a magnificent plane. It's very unfortunate that they launched the "shortened" version. The design and engineering was done for longer fuselage, so it actually has extra structure (and extra weight!) and larger wings than necessary. And it launched just before engines got a lot more efficient. The upside for passengers is that it's still the smoothest flying experience, even in turbulence. Boeing's 747 was incred…

>Boeing's 747 was incredibly profitable at the time, so it cross-subsidized other aircraft like the 737 (which competed with the A320). Launching the A380 countered that effect, and it made all segments more competitive. It all comes down to fuel prices. Lamenting for the age of the 747 is the same as missing those boat size finned Cadillacs. It was another era. The ETOPS ratings of modern engines and fuel efficiency…

"They will live on as cargo planes for outsized loads"

For outsized loads, you need an articulated nose or tail, like a cargo 747, a C-17, C5, A400M, AN124, etc. It is generally economically unfeasible to modify an aircraft to add this kind of feature, although it has been done on a limited basis for specific missions, for example the Boeing 747 Large Cargo Freighter with an articulated tail, or the super guppies, or Airbus Beluga. Note that those modifications were all purpose built for a specific task, not general purpose cargo aircraft.

The A380 does not have a side cargo door, reinforced floorbeams, or a cabin fire extinguisher system, so currently it cannot even take on palletized freight, much less outsized loads. It is not uncommon for aftermarket companies to modify retired passenger aircraft to add reinforced floorbeams, a side cargo door, etc, so this could happen, if some company decides that it is a profitable mod. IAI is doing this with older 777s right now. https://aviationweek.com/mro/aircraft-propulsion/iai-open-bo...

Re: Qantas is bringing back Airbus A380s from the California desert

#50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can feel that glide too. You are flying along, then feel a slight gliding fall, then a wobble. You always feel any turbulence during the glides too. Sorry for the highly technical terms but I agree it is unique to the A380. Apart from this they comfortable to travel and sleep on.

What are "glides"?

I think it's the slight (unexpected and short duration) change in altitude. That sensation of ground falling under your feet, with a slight sense of suspension. As if the craft is sliding down. (Glide as in gliding down a slope.)
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