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Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

oceanservice.noaa.gov

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Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#41

Post by CardenB »

xiphias2 wrote: post #32

They should get rid of these terms, as they are distracting. A big part of the training material for boating license is about learning things that people are not using in practice, which makes less time / mental power to learn what is really important to survive and avoid crash (what's really important).

They are not distracting. There are many intense situations on a boat, and a crew is required to cooperate in order to survive. This means you must have extremely precise wording to quickly explain what needs to be done. This vocabulary is important for this reason, and is able to sharpen focus, rather than distract.

It requires a process of learning, and that is intentional.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#43

Post by taeric »

xg15 wrote: post #29
taeric wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can see it as advantageous. With the major caveat that it is only advantageous to folks that have been taught it. Not shockingly, a large portion of the passengers on a boat are going to be confused if told to go to the starboard windows to see the whales that are beside the boat. How will you explain it? I'm going to guess that you will probably say "right." :D. (Note that this isn't hypothetical. I take a ferry f…

Yes, in that situation, you can confidently tell them to look to their right, because you can assume that most of them will sit in direction of travel and face forward. However, the same is not true for a sailor who might be running around on deck.

This isn't accurate, either. Most of us are decidedly not facing the direction of travel. Specifically, we are evenly split in large parts of the boat, as they have bench chairs that face each other. Or you are on the side of the boat facing out.

The ferry is actually a very odd boat in this, btw. As I am not clear that starboard/port are fixed. The boat literally goes in both directions, such that I'm assuming I don't have to know which is the "front" of it irrespective of the direction it is currently traveling.

I get your point, that things can be difficult. And I appreciate having jargon that is specific for an attempt to make things clearer. I just find this as the sole explanation kind of unsatisfactory. Seeing the history of the terms makes a lot more sense.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#44

Post by xg15 »

1123581321 wrote: post #19
drewrv wrote: post #8

I understand that the terms are mostly unambiguous, but I always wonder how these get defined in edge cases. For example ferries, at least where I live, alternate the direction of travel as they go back and forth. There isn't a fixed "bow" or "stern" from which to define port and starboard.

Those ferries should be switching the direction the crew faces (perhaps in a different structure on the other end of the boat) and turning on the appropriate lights so port and starboard are lit correctly. They should have two sets of colored lights to handle travel in both directions.

Don't they have to swap the lights anyway if the ferry reverses direction? After all, the red/green indicators are primarily for showing which direction the ship is moving in.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#45

Post by dan-robertson »

tim_hutton wrote: post #28

The only was I can remember which is port and starboard is by thinking about boarding an airplane. The steps/tunnel are always docked on the 'port' side, just as boats always dock on the port side. The cockpit/bow is always on your left when you board.

I always remember the phrase ‘there’s no port left in the bottle’. Similarly, the port-side navigation lights are red, the same colour as port.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#46

Post by Xylakant »

phire wrote: post #20
drewrv wrote: post #8

I understand that the terms are mostly unambiguous, but I always wonder how these get defined in edge cases. For example ferries, at least where I live, alternate the direction of travel as they go back and forth. There isn't a fixed "bow" or "stern" from which to define port and starboard.

For bidirectional ferries, I assume they just pick a direction all the way back at design time and stick to it. The direction might not matter, but consistency does.

I’m fairly confident that the “bow” in that case is always the direction of travel in this case and that starboard/port side change.

The lighting scheme on ships indicates the starboard side with a green light and the port side with a red light. This allows ships to figure out which way another ship is heading - especially at night. If you can see the red light on the left and green on the right while facing the other ship it’s going away from you, if it’s reversed then it’s coming towards you. If you can only see green it’s going to your right, to your left if you can see red.

Retaining that property is important for navigation, so starboard and port have to swap sides.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#47

Post by lsaferite »

CardenB wrote: post #41
xiphias2 wrote: post #32

They should get rid of these terms, as they are distracting. A big part of the training material for boating license is about learning things that people are not using in practice, which makes less time / mental power to learn what is really important to survive and avoid crash (what's really important).

They are not distracting. There are many intense situations on a boat, and a crew is required to cooperate in order to survive. This means you must have extremely precise wording to quickly explain what needs to be done. This vocabulary is important for this reason, and is able to sharpen focus, rather than distract. It requires a process of learning, and that is intentional.

In English "right" is one syllable and "starboard" is two. All things considered, using right/left is more concise. If you are aware enough of your orientation on a boat to know where port and starboard are located, you are also aware enough to know where left and right are located.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#48

Post by jprete »

phire wrote: post #20
drewrv wrote: post #8

I understand that the terms are mostly unambiguous, but I always wonder how these get defined in edge cases. For example ferries, at least where I live, alternate the direction of travel as they go back and forth. There isn't a fixed "bow" or "stern" from which to define port and starboard.

For bidirectional ferries, I assume they just pick a direction all the way back at design time and stick to it. The direction might not matter, but consistency does.

They can’t do it that way because the question of right of way only matters when two boats are going towards each other. The coloration is an easy visual indicator of where a boat is generally going that doesn’t require seeing any other part of the boat to work, and will even work in fog. You cannot safely flip the directions for any fraction of the boat’s travel.

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#49

Post by dan-robertson »

Clamchop wrote: post #27
binarymax wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because left and right are ambiguous - are you talking about MY left or the boat’s left? Having unambiguous names let’s us differentiate and avoid confusion. It might be hard to grok the need for this if you’ve never been in a tight spot while sailing or operating a watercraft with a crew - but having this distinction has probably saved thousands of bad incidents from happening.

Yes but why would you ever be talking about your left? Use the definite article, THE left, and it should be clear by convention for the sailors. I think it's just historical.

Pass that to the left

Re: Why do ships use “port” and “starboard” instead of “left” and “right?”

#50

Post by DonHopkins »

Clamchop wrote: post #27
binarymax wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because left and right are ambiguous - are you talking about MY left or the boat’s left? Having unambiguous names let’s us differentiate and avoid confusion. It might be hard to grok the need for this if you’ve never been in a tight spot while sailing or operating a watercraft with a crew - but having this distinction has probably saved thousands of bad incidents from happening.

Yes but why would you ever be talking about your left? Use the definite article, THE left, and it should be clear by convention for the sailors. I think it's just historical.

As opposed to "the other left".
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