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Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

economist.com

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Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#281

Post by WalterBright »

antman wrote: post #240
WalterBright wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider Japan: (fact) a single market with a single language (fact) geographically isolated (fact) not much space (fact) burned to the ground in WW2 and yet for a while it was an economic powerhouse on the world stage. Taiwan, Hong Kong and S Korea, similar stories. So what is the common thread? Free markets.

(fact) Market was not free, US imports were taxed for decades and Japanese exports to the US were not effectively subsidizing Japanese economy for political reasons

Nothing is a perfect free market. One can still reap the benefits of free markets without them being perfect.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#282

Post by [deleted] »

PostOnce wrote: post #166

My 2 cents, some of the reasons America succeeds: (fact) America is a single market with a single language with basically a single set of regulations. Expansion is cheap in America. It makes a hell of a lot more sense to expand to another US city than it does to expand to Norway or New Zealand; but for a company in those countries, expansion is very expensive, expanding requires new laws, regulations, business entiti…

[deleted]

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#283

Post by elefanten »

PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #252
WalterBright wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it wouldn't exist without your efforts, then you created it. There's no mystery to it. People freely willing to pay for it with their own money is sufficient evidence.

But if it wouldn't exist without other's people efforts too, then what? And they may be people you don't know. They may be people who are dead. "paying with their own money" ... ack, not this simplistic nonsense again. People temporarily gain control over some measure of various economic resources. It's not their own money, beyond some temporary mutual agreement. Tomorrow, it may not be. Also, people pay for things r…

You’re mixing different levels of abstraction and equivocating across them.

Sure, no human could produce anything modern on their own, without knowledge, training, support, materials, products, labor, etc. that comes from others. A child raised by wolves will never launch a new line of tennis shoes.

At the same time, no complex effort comes to be without someone’s motivation and effort to take the risk, coordinate the activity and see it through. It doesn’t have to be one primary person to do so, but it certainly can be. It is not difficult to look at the history of a given project and conclude who most acutely put it into motion. The choice to incentivize this acute influence has trade-offs, but many different societies across history have tried many variations of what / where to incentivize. Abstracted, that’s one of the main points being discussed here.

That doesn’t mean all stories about who started / created / produced something are told accurately. But to throw your hands up and say “everything comes from everyone” is completely useless when designing society with the goal of solving problems, providing for its members and improving the human condition.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#284

Post by WalterBright »

dopidopHN wrote: post #244
WalterBright wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US was very helpful in protecting Cuba from the competition from the US economy. Somehow, that didn't work out for Cuba.

You mean sanctions?

That's what sanctions are. Protecting another country from your economy.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#285

Post by TapWaterBandit »

PostOnce wrote: post #166

My 2 cents, some of the reasons America succeeds: (fact) America is a single market with a single language with basically a single set of regulations. Expansion is cheap in America. It makes a hell of a lot more sense to expand to another US city than it does to expand to Norway or New Zealand; but for a company in those countries, expansion is very expensive, expanding requires new laws, regulations, business entiti…

> On the other hand, it's not all doom and gloom overseas, here in NZ all I have to do to start a business is walk outside and start selling shit. To file taxes for that all I have to do is fill in my Net Income on a 1 page web form and click Submit. There's no medical debt, car insurance costs $100 a year, and nothing has a barrier to entry; I can talk to the person in charge at just about any company or organization in NZ.

Can I ask why you chose to move to NZ considering the rest of your comment? Do you intend to move back to the USA in the near future?

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#286

Post by indecisive_user »

bryanrasmussen wrote: post #88
marianatom wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More available produce year round. Cheaper imported food from around the world due to dollar's strength. More diverse cuisines in big cities, with a lot better Asian cuisines (sushi!) in general than France, due to large immigrations.

The definition of richness in food is generally heavy in natural fats in proteins, high in butter and cream of a high quality. American butter and cream is ludicrously bad. There is just enough taste to it to make the stuff inedible. Sushi is not a rich food. Sauces with a lot of butter and fats in them are 'rich', pastries can be rich, depending mainly on the fattiness of the cream and butter. on edit: French cuisin…

In this case, the parent comment used "richness" as a synonym for being diverse and high quality.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#287

Post by ip26 »

phist_mcgee wrote: post #277
ip26 wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am constitutionally incapable of lowering my expectations My heart swells at this part and I want to cheer.

To outsiders, this dogmatic 'exceptionalism' appears revolting. My 2c.

What is exceptionalism and what is cultural values? Is it equally revolting if Europeans are proud of a culture of having & taking long parental leave?

It resonates with me because it describes me. It’s not uniquely American, but it still describes me & the (American immigrant) culture I grew up in.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#288

Post by asah »

quicklime wrote: post #266
PostOnce wrote: post #166

My 2 cents, some of the reasons America succeeds: (fact) America is a single market with a single language with basically a single set of regulations. Expansion is cheap in America. It makes a hell of a lot more sense to expand to another US city than it does to expand to Norway or New Zealand; but for a company in those countries, expansion is very expensive, expanding requires new laws, regulations, business entiti…

I do agree with many of your points here, but just to nitpick... > (fact) Americans are ambitious to a fault...9 to 5 in the suburbs is not an endgame for me. So you state this as a fact about Americans in general, but then use yourself as the only proof. Isn’t 9 to 5 in the suburbs basically the end goal that most Americans dream of? I definitely think that Americans are more entrepreneurial than most, but other cul…

It's relative. There's a culture of ambition, competition, success and financial reward here in the US. Other countries have it, but in the US it's organized. It's so crazy, everything is setup to compete. The latest craziness: top universities have multiple, competing startup incubator programs - each!

(I have many more stories of course)

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#289

Post by WalterBright »

andrewjl wrote: post #243
WalterBright wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider Japan: (fact) a single market with a single language (fact) geographically isolated (fact) not much space (fact) burned to the ground in WW2 and yet for a while it was an economic powerhouse on the world stage. Taiwan, Hong Kong and S Korea, similar stories. So what is the common thread? Free markets.

> So what is the common thread? Free markets. Not when it comes to Japan. During the post-war boom era the majority of its largest businesses were conglomerates with interlocking ownership structures that prevented accountability to shareholders. In addition to that a large amount of corporate investment was state-directed by the Ministry of International Trade and Industry (MITI). It was an effective system (at leas…

This is not as cut and dried as you suggest.

https://www.cato.org/sites/cato.org/files/serials/files/cato...

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#290

Post by ip26 »

quicklime wrote: post #266
PostOnce wrote: post #166

My 2 cents, some of the reasons America succeeds: (fact) America is a single market with a single language with basically a single set of regulations. Expansion is cheap in America. It makes a hell of a lot more sense to expand to another US city than it does to expand to Norway or New Zealand; but for a company in those countries, expansion is very expensive, expanding requires new laws, regulations, business entiti…

I do agree with many of your points here, but just to nitpick... > (fact) Americans are ambitious to a fault...9 to 5 in the suburbs is not an endgame for me. So you state this as a fact about Americans in general, but then use yourself as the only proof. Isn’t 9 to 5 in the suburbs basically the end goal that most Americans dream of? I definitely think that Americans are more entrepreneurial than most, but other cul…

They never claimed Americans are the only ambitious people, or even the most ambitious. Just “very ambitious”, in a list of factors that (put together) allegedly combined to explain the notable outcome.

There are other countries that can’t be invaded, or speak a single language, or have a large market, or have ambitious people, or culturally permit failure without ostracizing people.

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