Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record • Hacker News Board

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#21

Post by jutrewag » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:00 PM UTC

crop_rotation wrote: post #8

How would Europe even compete with America in the long run. America just has so many advantages (massive influx of talented workers, one country, better equiped with natural resources, the supremacy of the dolllar). There are many other reasons some of which might not seem clear cut. The average American or European life requires an economy which is on average much better than the average for the world. If you do not…

Let in a lot more immigrants, and not the refugee kind. Vetted, high skilled immigrants. Let those immigrants have something at stake i.e. provide a path to citizenship. Provide automatic citizenship to children of those immigrants born in Europe.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#22

Post by dauertewigkeit » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:00 PM UTC

non- wrote: post #6

> The flexibility of the labour market helps employment adapt to shifting patterns of demand. Already many of the workers in America who were laid off from Alphabet and other tech firms at the start of the year are applying their sought-after skills elsewhere, or setting up their own businesses. In continental Europe, by contrast, tech firms are still negotiating lay-offs, and may think twice about hiring there in fu…

It works as long as demand is high, which is true for the US tech job market but not so true for the EU tech job market.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#23

Post by boeingUH60 » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:00 PM UTC

swalling wrote: post #17

”Average incomes have grown much faster than in western Europe or Japan. Also adjusted for purchasing power, they exceed $50,000 in Mississippi, America’s poorest state—higher than in France.” The article casually dismisses the counterpoint that the US trades high income for a lower social safety net. The average French person has a life expectancy of 82. In Mississippi it’s 74.9, on par with Lithuania. Even Vietnam…

Obesity might play a role...they're eating too much food!

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#24

Post by manojr13 » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:01 PM UTC

Any level of income growth at the expense of income disparity and safety is not worth it. US will slowly become a net emigration center during this decade. The symptoms are already mushrooming.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#25

Post by seizethecheese » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:02 PM UTC

swalling wrote: post #17

”Average incomes have grown much faster than in western Europe or Japan. Also adjusted for purchasing power, they exceed $50,000 in Mississippi, America’s poorest state—higher than in France.” The article casually dismisses the counterpoint that the US trades high income for a lower social safety net. The average French person has a life expectancy of 82. In Mississippi it’s 74.9, on par with Lithuania. Even Vietnam…

Can you propose an adjusted income metric that takes social programs into account?

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#26

Post by camillomiller » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:02 PM UTC

crop_rotation wrote: post #13

non- wrote: post #6

> The flexibility of the labour market helps employment adapt to shifting patterns of demand. Already many of the workers in America who were laid off from Alphabet and other tech firms at the start of the year are applying their sought-after skills elsewhere, or setting up their own businesses. In continental Europe, by contrast, tech firms are still negotiating lay-offs, and may think twice about hiring there in fu…

The European approach makes a lot of sense in other stable industries (Automobile/Steel). But in a fast moving quick changing (e.g. Tech) industries, all it does is prevent new risky companies from starting and making it harder for them to adapt. Maybe it is a good thing. But only time can tell that. So far to me it seems like the American approach is winning economy wise.

It’s also generating insane levels of inequality, so it really only works if you subscribe to the capitalistic illusion that GDP is a good indicator of the success of a society.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#27

Post by b1ue64 » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:02 PM UTC

marianatom wrote: post #20

swalling wrote: post #17

”Average incomes have grown much faster than in western Europe or Japan. Also adjusted for purchasing power, they exceed $50,000 in Mississippi, America’s poorest state—higher than in France.” The article casually dismisses the counterpoint that the US trades high income for a lower social safety net. The average French person has a life expectancy of 82. In Mississippi it’s 74.9, on par with Lithuania. Even Vietnam…

lower life expectancy in US in general can be attributed to a more unhealthy diet and less walking, which is on the flip side due to US's economic success - affordance for more food and richer food, as well as affordance for car as transportation. Another attribution is the larger amount of immigrants, which as a segment has lower income level and thus lower life expectancy

> can be attributed to more unhealthy diet and less walking, which is on the flip side due to US's economic success - affordance for more food and richer food, as well as affordance for car as transportation.

people in the US aren't driving because they can afford cars - they have to drive because they don't have any other viable options due to the way american cities are designed

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#28

Post by Timon3 » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:03 PM UTC

crop_rotation wrote: post #13

non- wrote: post #6

> The flexibility of the labour market helps employment adapt to shifting patterns of demand. Already many of the workers in America who were laid off from Alphabet and other tech firms at the start of the year are applying their sought-after skills elsewhere, or setting up their own businesses. In continental Europe, by contrast, tech firms are still negotiating lay-offs, and may think twice about hiring there in fu…

The European approach makes a lot of sense in other stable industries (Automobile/Steel). But in a fast moving quick changing (e.g. Tech) industries, all it does is prevent new risky companies from starting and making it harder for them to adapt. Maybe it is a good thing. But only time can tell that. So far to me it seems like the American approach is winning economy wise.

Economy-wise maybe, but there is more to workers rights than that. They also affect things like life expectancy and quality of life.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#29

Post by 35208654 » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:03 PM UTC

BenFranklin100 wrote: post #9

As the article points out, immigration is a key factor behind America’s economic performance. Too many people in tech are hostile to immigration out of a misplaced fear of immigrants lowering wages or ‘stealing’ their jobs. Whatever legitimate merits those concerns may have - and research shows them to be few — let’s never forget that the hard work and entrepreneurial spirit of immigrants help create these well-payin…

And we treat them, for that hard work and entrepreneurial spirit quite terribly. As a native born American I’ve been appalled at the mistreatment of H1B workers, and even those on other more “generous” employment terms.

Some of the brightest, hardest working and genuinely wonderful people I’ve worked with have practically crawled over hot coals to get here. They are indeed a source of the United States’ economic dynamism and we would do well to treat them well if we intend to maintain that dynamism.

Re: Lessons from America’s astonishing economic record

#30

Post by bryanrasmussen » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 5:04 PM UTC

crop_rotation wrote: post #13

non- wrote: post #6

> The flexibility of the labour market helps employment adapt to shifting patterns of demand. Already many of the workers in America who were laid off from Alphabet and other tech firms at the start of the year are applying their sought-after skills elsewhere, or setting up their own businesses. In continental Europe, by contrast, tech firms are still negotiating lay-offs, and may think twice about hiring there in fu…

The European approach makes a lot of sense in other stable industries (Automobile/Steel). But in a fast moving quick changing (e.g. Tech) industries, all it does is prevent new risky companies from starting and making it harder for them to adapt. Maybe it is a good thing. But only time can tell that. So far to me it seems like the American approach is winning economy wise.

There is no actual European approach, there are different levels of worker's rights across various industries and in different countries. In Denmark if you have been working for more than a month than when you are fired you have a certain amount of time that you get paid (unless you find a new job), but you still have to work for them if the company wants you to.

In the tech industry it is generally 3 months and they don't want you to work during that period.