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GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

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Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#311
post #266
post #5

Car infotainment systems are terrible. That's the reason why everyone wants CarPlay and Android Auto. It's kind of like going back to flip phones after using smartphones for years.

I don't want CarPlay or Android Auto. It's one more thing I have to fiddle with. One more thing to fight while someone beside me or behind me becomes impatient. Bluetooth is meh. I would rather have an aux cord. From the days when we connected systems by physically connecting systems. I am in the car to drive, a delightful escape from interacting with a phone.

1. You don't have to CarPlay or Android Auto if you don't want to. Just don't connect your phone. 2. Have you heard of a USB cable?

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#313
post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I genuinely wonder how they justify that figure. They could maybe justify a subscription if they offered a significant service, but they are by definition going to deliver a worse experience than CarPlay/Android Auto - simply due to it not being your own smartphone. Why would anyone buy an expensive car which is designed to last a decade while it has essential pre-installed features locked behind a subscription? If t…

The figure is utterly ridiculous. They truly expect to generate a revenue stream 2x the size of Spotify or AirPods? Apple as a whole only makes 21B a year from all services, and they run everything from cloud storage, to synchronization, to an App Store with a wild profit margin from fees. Of course, all American auto makers have wildly unrealistic plans for electric vehicle adoption in the next 5 years, too -- i thi…

What's more ludicrous is that they expect to generate a revenue stream 1/6th the size of their entire automotive enterprise. You'll pay $300/mo for a car payment, and $40/mo for OnStar Audio, and $10/mo will be earned from selling your data and showing ads on your nav system.

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#314
post #226

Ideally, my car would look like a BT speaker, possibly with a microphone and some controls, to the phone. I don't want a dedicated satnav, I don't want an elaborate in-car entertainment system. The reason is twofold. The first is that all of these in-car systems are pretty dated even after a couple of years. The second is that they tend to be fairly low quality to begin with. The system in my car that integrates with…

Like how I want a dumb TV with the system of my choice hooked up behind it. You can't trust the TV manufacturer to keep the OS up-to-date, and with TV prices always going down it's inevitable they'll cut corners to increase their profit margins.

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

was . It's gotten a lot better.

Yes. It only took 6 years to catch up. Google has better POI support, but I now use Apple Maps for pretty much all my nav needs.

6 years (and all the money) seems a decent trade off for strategic autonomy, and cutting a foot off Google-on-iPhone.

I.e. why lock down permissions if Google would get location data from every phone through Google Maps anyway.

Furthermore, it decreases the value of Google Maps by depriving them of traffic data (something that really only works at scale when the maps user base is "most people").

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#316
post #32

How does this business decision make sense? A car is a high-margin item, so the impact of even a handful of consumers choosing not to buy must be huge, right? Whereas, they would need to "monetize" (ugh) many many more units to turn back that lost profit. And as the shakeup due to EVs begins, even loyal consumers will be considering other makes. My girlfriend bought a car recently. CarPlay was not negotiable for her,…

I agree it's totally perplexing. GM doesn't have a moat, all of their vehicles have competition.

Could this just be a bluff/negotiation tactic or something?

It seems so perplexing to remove these features, rather than giving the option for Android auto and car play along with their own android platform. If their own system has better native functionality, people will see this as a selling point. If not, they're free to ignore it.

Cars are not TVs. It's a major purchase that somebody will be using for years, so people will pay attention to this kind of detail. Surely they know this?

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#317
post #226

Ideally, my car would look like a BT speaker, possibly with a microphone and some controls, to the phone. I don't want a dedicated satnav, I don't want an elaborate in-car entertainment system. The reason is twofold. The first is that all of these in-car systems are pretty dated even after a couple of years. The second is that they tend to be fairly low quality to begin with. The system in my car that integrates with…

> The first is that all of these in-car systems are pretty dated even after a couple of years. CarPlay can't really get out of date any more than iOS can get out of date. It's just a software push. The main problem with the stereo in my car is that not everything is in CarPlay, so you have this sort of absurd situation where CarPlay is supposedly just one function of many, when obviously FM radio should just be an ap…

It’s a little silly, but it avoids the complexity of the car needing to describe every feature to CarPlay. It’s very hard to create an abstraction that allows for any capability, setting, message to be displayed and interacted with.

For instance, some 4x4’s have 2D inclinometers. Modern trucks have all sorts of crazy optimizations for towing.

Requiring CarPlay to understand and adopt new car-specific features gets crazy.

Making CarPlay a system that runs apps provided by the car is also crazy complex.

I have no doubt we’re heading that direction, but it is such a more complicated system for marginal benefit that it’s not surprising we’re stuck at a plateau where it works for 80% of scenarios.

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#318
post #32

How does this business decision make sense? A car is a high-margin item, so the impact of even a handful of consumers choosing not to buy must be huge, right? Whereas, they would need to "monetize" (ugh) many many more units to turn back that lost profit. And as the shakeup due to EVs begins, even loyal consumers will be considering other makes. My girlfriend bought a car recently. CarPlay was not negotiable for her,…

I agree it's totally perplexing. GM doesn't have a moat, all of their vehicles have competition. Could this just be a bluff/negotiation tactic or something? It seems so perplexing to remove these features, rather than giving the option for Android auto and car play along with their own android platform. If their own system has better native functionality, people will see this as a selling point. If not, they're free…

> If their own system has better native functionality, people will see this as a selling point. If not, they're free to ignore it.

This implicitly assumes that the manufacturer's direct cost of integrating/supporting such features, and indirect opportunity costs of not deploying an alternative replacement, are both effectively $0.

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#319
post #32

How does this business decision make sense? A car is a high-margin item, so the impact of even a handful of consumers choosing not to buy must be huge, right? Whereas, they would need to "monetize" (ugh) many many more units to turn back that lost profit. And as the shakeup due to EVs begins, even loyal consumers will be considering other makes. My girlfriend bought a car recently. CarPlay was not negotiable for her,…

I think this makes a ton of business sense. They're only doing this on EV's, which have to be charged, and are likely concerned your car infotainment system is going to become a platform people buy things on they don't want to miss out on. Tesla has done it and because of this they have the best infotainment system in the industry. Frankly from what I can tell as well this is just editorialization, I don't think GM c…

It makes a lot of business sense if you think people pick their cars first and phones second.

Sort of a spherical cows optimization.

GM is going to discover that cars are now phone accessories for most people, not the other way around.

Re: GM’s decision to ditch Apple CarPlay, Android Auto sparks backlash

#320

Detaching the entertainment system from the car and making it just a dumb touchscreen and speakers must have really grinded the gears of auto makers. I can now upgrade my entire entertainment system, GPS, phone, etc. by replacing a phone. They’d prefer you get another car when your system is feeling old. I don’t even understand why my 2020 car had an optional GPS add-on for thousands of dollars. Android Auto / CarPla…

had an optional GPS add-on for thousands of dollars I guess it's for people who don't know better. Even a standalone GPS won't cost that much, and as a bonus, you can take it with you.

I live in Japan, and Apple and Google maps really don’t cut it here. I paid for a dedicated GPS unit in my car, and the benefits are:

* Location on the map is represented far more accurately

* Knows which way I am pointed and can give accurate directions as soon as I start navigation, while sometimes with my phone I need to move a bit for it to know which way I’m oriented

* Works in tunnels

* Tends to stick to main roads while Apple and Google maps are far too aggressive sending me down side roads or crossing over 2 lanes of traffic.

* Don’t need to pause navigation or mess around with my phone when getting in and out of the car for breaks

* Has detailed information about the services/stores/restaurants available at each rest stop along the highway, and distances to each stop

* Detailed information about lane closures, temporary speed limit reductions due to weather, chain restrictions, etc

* Displays accurate representations of street signs and 3d renderings of off ramps

* Displays landmarks at intersections (e.g. turn right before the ramen shop on the right)

* Much more customizable interface. I can choose whether I want it to display gas stations, convenience stores, parking, etc. on the map. How many prompts before a turn. I can enable or disable various features like split-screen turn guidance, etc.

I have used both CarPlay and the built-in GPS, and overwhelmingly prefer the built-in GPS. So I disagree that it is just for people who “don’t know better”.

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