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Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

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Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#11
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

Agreement, I do not understand this backwards movement in the DevOps world. My hypothesis is that they are catering to a different group, i.e. enabling developers to do Ops, who don't want to learn TF and want to use their preferred language. DevOps first practitioners are in short supply, so it makes sense there is a market for this.

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#12
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

Maybe it shines if your infrastructure is really dynamic?

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#13
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

Atlantis is basically just a terraform oriented command runner. I believe you can create a custom Atlantis workflow that'll just run `pulumi preview` or `pulumi up`. That's how Atlantis supports terragrunt as well: https://www.runatlantis.io/docs/custom-workflows.html#terrag...

Our experience with Terraform is exactly the same as what you're describing with Pulumi. We have hundreds of stacks and they are all implemented differently because they are written by a hundred different people with varying knowledge of Terraform. Terraform is a goofy language and it's very hard to do even simple things like conditionals. There is also a massive amount of copy/paste because people have no idea how to set up their provider or remote states and terraform has no real way to make those DRY.

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#14
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

Maybe it shines if your infrastructure is really dynamic?

The project I'm on involves dynamic infrastructure. I don't see any benefit Pulumi provides over Terraform in this regard. In fact, Terraform's module system is more convenient if you want to do per-tenant infra versioning for example.

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#15
post #4

CDK/Pulumi are going to be used by LLMs to spin up website infra exactly to spec. Devs will fill in the business logic interfaces. Going to be wild

Why would you need LLMs for a boilerplate web application?

There is a "need" vs "want" aspect here, but often the boilerplates that we reach for become out of date. In theory, an LLM producing these could remain up to date without maintenance, key phrase "in theory"

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#16
Hey, I'm curious about the pulumi-ai cli.

Specifically, did you solve the problem of stale API information?

What I mean is that using gpt-4 to generate code is generally very straightforward, but due to the knowledge cutoff it won't know about i.e. new AWS APIs like Lambda URLs.

Is this something you've managed to solve? Or is it just the "even with that knowledge cutoff there's enough value" situation?

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#17
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

I think the fact that there are “infrastructure people” vending infra for devs is usually evidence of a mistake. If you have platform engineers, sure, that makes a ton of sense. But adding friction to the developer workflow of waiting for someone else to do something that’s an API call away is strange

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#18
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

I've also made the switch from managing a few thousand Terraform modules to handling most app-code things in Pulumi and have run into some of these limitations.

With Terraform + Terragrunt + Atlantis, we created https://github.com/transcend-io/terragrunt-atlantis-config and had an extremely robust and easy to use flow for updating all infra code.

We've since moved to an approach where more of our infra/security things are managed in Terraform (like Guardduty, SSO, Github repo settings, etc.) maintained by more devops folks, and our app code is mostly in Pulumi (lambdas, Fargate, CloudFront/CloudFlare CDNs, etc.). To accomplish this without something like Atlantis, we moved the app code infra deployments from being deployed continuously pre-merge via Atlantis to being deployed via `pulumi up` calls in our normal CI flows, so like right next to where we build the docker images and restart ECS services, as an example.

Overall I actually really love this flow. It is so, so much easier to create multi-regional infra in Pulumi with a quick for loop, and it's also much easier to do things like run esbuild over our code in typescript, and then bundle the output of that call and send it up to a Lambda function all from pulumi/typescript without needing separate build steps or to do things like using terragrunt pre-hooks or Docker build steps inside terraform provisioners, which I always found slow and clunky.

I would agree that Pulumi's plans are a disappointment though, exactly as you said.

Overall I've been happy with the change, and we've seen some improvements I think in the velocity that developers can launch services that meet our requirements.

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#19
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

You can automate both Terraform and Pulumi in a similar way to Atlantis using Spacelift[0] (though generally with a lot of additional features and customizability thrown in vs Atlantis; but you can also accomplish basically the exact Atlantis flow).

It's a CI/CD system specialized in Infrastructure-as-Code.

[0]: https://spacelift.io

Disclaimer: Software Engineer at Spacelift, though I'm recommending it not just because I work there, but because I think it's legitimately a very good product.

Re: Pulumi Insights – AI generated IaC programs

#20
post #7

Sorry to be offtopic, but I've been using Pulumi at work for the past 6 months and I'm really not impressed. It's basically just Terraform but worse, with a million ways to declare your infrastructure instead of just one. Infrastructure people tend not to write the best code and from my observation the extra freedom of an imperative language just makes stuff even more complex and harder to maintain. It's also much ha…

You can automate both Terraform and Pulumi in a similar way to Atlantis using Spacelift[0] (though generally with a lot of additional features and customizability thrown in vs Atlantis; but you can also accomplish basically the exact Atlantis flow). It's a CI/CD system specialized in Infrastructure-as-Code. [0]: https://spacelift.io Disclaimer: Software Engineer at Spacelift, though I'm recommending it not just becau…

Thanks for reminding me about this, we came across it a while ago. I should book a call. Do you guys support on-premise hosting?
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