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Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

mathalicious.com

41–50 of 192 posts

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#41
post #3

Silly article. It offers no proof to their statement that students learning through Khan are on a "wild goose chase" for correct answers except for a 1973(!) paper. I believe it to be the opposite, the chances of you just guessing 10 correct answers in a row is ridiculously low. It encourages you to make sure every answer is correct before submitting it, otherwise you would have to start over again. It doesn't addres…

> I believe it to be the opposite, the chances of you just guessing 10 correct answers in a row is ridiculously low. It encourages you to make sure every answer is correct before submitting it, otherwise you would have to start over again.

That's not the point. You can learn to solve ten math problems in a row by simply memorizing algorithms to solve the problems, rather than learning the underlying concepts. The author criticizes Khan Academy because its methods emphasize the algorithms, rather than the concepts.

There's a good bit of research suggesting that the ability to solve quantitative problems isn't necessarily related to underlying qualitative understanding. Students could benefit from teaching methods designed to promote understanding.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#42

For many of us teachers, this is somewhat disconcerting. Gamification is fine when students are trying to save Zelda, but it’s more problematic when math becomes an obstacle, and eighth grade just another “level.” The author is delusional. That's exactly what 8th, or any other grade, is. Get enough points, proceed to the next grade. Score high enough on the leader board, proceed to the college you want.

I'm shocked by how often this needs to be pointed out.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#43
Interesting assessment of what I've always considered to be a successful learning supplement. Not an alternative, and certainly not a revolution, but something people of all ages and backgrounds can refer to when needed. It's a wonderful resource, and this article attempts to diagnose some sort of nonexistent problem with it. It even seems to back off at the end, as if the author realizes he's done little to identify a problem and less to propose an alternative (or even market his product).

Now, if he was going to complain about the "intuitive" approach of KA, he might've had something. Alternatives to KA like PatrickJMT have been successful (to an extent) because some feel that Khan is perhaps a bit too gentle with his teaching method. Baptism by fire certainly appeals to some.

I hate to say it, because comments like these always feel a bit hollow to me, but "Sour grapes" is all that comes to mind with this article.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#44
post #26
post #13

To address our challenges, we need to do what every other successful country has done: invest in professional development; give teachers more time to collaborate; and provide them with resources that help them not only meet the learning standards, but exceed them. You could have copy/pasted that conclusion without altering a word from the debate about every other educational reform: school choice/vouchers, NCLB, high…

You seem awefully cynical considering that you sell software to teachers (which they themself pay for) so that they can teach their children more efficiently. I mean I have no love for unions and I am well aware that they have no great love for the students but even so, isn't your point a bit to cynical?

One can have a lot of respect for teachers and still like education reform.

That said, I've also worked with big companies. This does not obligate me to believe that big companies are universally properly managed collections of competent, self-effacing employees who would never dream of advancing their own interests at the stake of the job. It also does not obligate me to believe that big companies cannot be improved, even radically improved, by measures which would discomfit at least some people who work for big companies.

Indeed, if I hypothetically believed either of those two things prior to working for a big company, working for them would have cured me of those delusions, rapidly.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#45
One thing I thought of: I think one way to really make education stronger, and cheaper, by utilizing technology, is to have your "point system" based on teaching people just under you. By teaching material, you also learn it more strongly yourself. And of course you have more "one-on-one" time with students while actually reducing the demand for professional teachers.

So maybe you could start with something like Khan Academy (it doesn't hurt to have the lines, dots, and steps documented somewhere). But then have some sort of social network (and I'm saying this as somebody who thinks that too many things have social networks) based on the ability to learn and teach skills.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#46

For many of us teachers, this is somewhat disconcerting. Gamification is fine when students are trying to save Zelda, but it’s more problematic when math becomes an obstacle, and eighth grade just another “level.” The author is delusional. That's exactly what 8th, or any other grade, is. Get enough points, proceed to the next grade. Score high enough on the leader board, proceed to the college you want.

The more invested and successful you are in some arbitrary game, the more you seek to justify the (nonexistent) purpose of the game. It's pretty scary.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#47
Khan Academy blew my mind when I heard the TED talk on it, no doubt this and software like it has a massive part in the future of education.

More recently I started learning a different language (the human kind) and it drove home even further how much more useful software can be to pickup problems with my understanding.

Let's assume you have an A+ class teacher the best of the best. They still have limited time with an entire class of students. It's simply not possible to diagnose and fix the little or big parts individuals are missing.

An awesome teacher with infinite time could, but that is not a possibility, it just doesn't scale.

About the article, haters going to hate, sounds jealous to me.

Ok point about still teaching using abstract examples, but hell that's a simple fix, throw in some real life ones. How does he use "millions of students across the world have used it" in his opening paragraph and then go on to try and say it's doing it wrong lol.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#49
post #13

To address our challenges, we need to do what every other successful country has done: invest in professional development; give teachers more time to collaborate; and provide them with resources that help them not only meet the learning standards, but exceed them. You could have copy/pasted that conclusion without altering a word from the debate about every other educational reform: school choice/vouchers, NCLB, high…

> the goal is to employ teachers and education of students is a welcome-but-unnecessary industrial byproduct. This is pretty much exactly what I was thinking, albeit less eloquently, as I read this article. The entire article, while it made good points, always had an undertone of "Khan Academy is dangerous to me, therefore it's dangerous for everyone." It could just be a difference of perspective - the author is a te…

> I'm not saying that Khan Academy is entirely the right direction to take ...

Delivering a lecture is not what teachers should spend their time on most. Why should millions of teachers explain Pythagoras' theorem all over again, verbally, when we could hire the best one to make a video and then use that video?

Teachers should be education counsellors, couches if you want. They should spend their time guiding students, not regurgitating the same lecture for the 1000th time.

Khan Academy has no fault. The author is just a scared teacher. He should focus more on his students and leave the presentation of material to the most eloquent. There only needs to be one or a few of those.

Re: Khan Academy: It’s Different This Time

#50
post #27

My idea on how to fix High School math. Spend the first 3 years doing nothing but mastering basic algebra. I've seen from tutoring my siblings that basic algebra skills are what they lack. They concepts of trig and calculus aren't that difficult, it's the algebra that trips them up. Leave the higher level math, for everyone but the most advanced students, to college. If I was a college math professor I'd rather teach…

This might work for some people, but as someone relatively smart and good at math, this would just make me want to cry myself to sleep at night. A smart student can master algebra/algebra 2 curriculum in a couple of months. A problem with a lot of high achievers is that they already feel like they are wasting time in high school, this just aggravates that problem.

My suggestion: Not everyone needs to learn that much math. Classes up to algebra 2 and also an intro to statistics are probably enough for most people. Note that this can be in high school or college. However, for those who want to be mathematicians/scientists/engineers/technical people, math education should diverge probably around 7th grade. Rather than teaching pre-algebra or algebra or whatever they do now, they should start teaching the students how to do proofs. The best thing about Ma 1a at Caltech (http://www.math.caltech.edu/~2011-12/1term/ma001a1/) is that about 60% of the material could be taught to a smart motivated 7th grader. Making the students do proofs with help everyone figure out either that they love math and its beautiful or that they aren't really that interested in math. With a more rigorous understanding of basic math, learning applications like calculus is a lot easier.

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