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Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

hetzner.com

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Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#261

Post by DarkPhily »

Deloritoono wrote: post #238
zackmorris wrote: post #209

I implemented a Virtual Private Cloud (VPC) on AWS with Elastic Container Service (ECS) using Terraform so that I could run Docker, and it ended up being about 2 orders of magnitude more expensive than Hetzner after all of the services were configured. For example, something as simple as AWS NAT Gateway costs $30 per month, and it can be challenging to get everything right if you don't use one. I haven't tried Heroku…

Hetzner is great but it's not a good choice for companies which really care. Your data is not encrypted in rest. Their security is not bad but someone can easily plugin whatever they like. Try this at Google. Google not just has much stricter physical access control but also FULL control over the hardware. They know the firmware of the Mainboard. The server don't even unencrypt and start if you move them out of their…

You are really comparing Google, which sells Cloud products, against a company which have a variety of products?

If you only compare the cloud products. How do you know that they aren't encrypting their drives?

And BTW, they own undersea cables as well ;) https://www.hetzner.com/presse-berichte/2016/01/156818

Please educate yourself before you make such wild claims.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#262

Post by e63f67dd-065b »

> The new server plans start at the unbeatable prices of just € 3.79 a month, which includes an IPv4 address, and there is no setup fee or minimum contract period. If users’ servers only exist for part of the month, they will only pay for the hours when the servers existed. This hourly billing option gives customers even more flexibility and will help keep costs low

Unless I'm blind, the price clearly says 4.52 EUR/mo with IPv4 at https://www.hetzner.com/cloud for a CAX11 instance, the smallest listed there.

Edit: nevermind, I didn't deselect Germany's 19% VAT. It is indeed 3.79 euros before sales tax.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#263

Post by 015a »

zackmorris wrote: post #209

I implemented a Virtual Private Cloud (VPC) on AWS with Elastic Container Service (ECS) using Terraform so that I could run Docker, and it ended up being about 2 orders of magnitude more expensive than Hetzner after all of the services were configured. For example, something as simple as AWS NAT Gateway costs $30 per month, and it can be challenging to get everything right if you don't use one. I haven't tried Heroku…

> I can't help but feel that the cloud infrastructure and microservice movement of the 2010s was.. a scam.

I think the general consensus is that the most-root cause for why cloud infrastructure and microservice architectures matter is more People, less Technology. Its hard to hire highly experienced people, especially at the hundreds-to-thousands of engineers scale that many companies operate at.

That, in isolation, is reasonable. The actually uncomfortable question that no one wants to address is: was that a scam. Put another way, how much of that was a zero-interest rate phenomena, and how much "state of art best way to engineer" things was influenced from that, and has root causes in US monetary policy.

Between AI and high interest rates: if you're not ready to spend the 2020s questioning every single thing you think you know about software engineering; you won't be long for the industry.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#264

Post by martin_a »

e63f67dd-065b wrote: post #262

> The new server plans start at the unbeatable prices of just € 3.79 a month, which includes an IPv4 address, and there is no setup fee or minimum contract period. If users’ servers only exist for part of the month, they will only pay for the hours when the servers existed. This hourly billing option gives customers even more flexibility and will help keep costs low Unless I'm blind, the price clearly says 4.52 EUR/m…

4.52 is the price with German VAT included, without it, it's 3.79.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#265

Post by usr1106 »

solarkraft wrote: post #51
jacooper wrote: post #45

Finally! That's where ARM Alta CPUs shine Try your luck to get them for free in oracle free tier, just make sure to have backups!

Oracle's free tier is cool. I've let my free instance expire and so far haven't noticed them doing anything weird with my credit card info. Also haven't been sued yet. But let's see.

Oracle did not accept my credit card. The same one AWS has been charging successfully for years.

But I don't really want to do business with Oracle anyway, maybe it's better so.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#266

Post by simplotek »

zackmorris wrote: post #209

I implemented a Virtual Private Cloud (VPC) on AWS with Elastic Container Service (ECS) using Terraform so that I could run Docker, and it ended up being about 2 orders of magnitude more expensive than Hetzner after all of the services were configured. For example, something as simple as AWS NAT Gateway costs $30 per month, and it can be challenging to get everything right if you don't use one. I haven't tried Heroku…

> So what's the point of all that? Seriously, one server with 16 cores and the memory bandwidth and storage speed of SSD drives should be able to serve many thousands of simultaneous requests and millions of users per month. I can't help but feel that the cloud infrastructure and microservice movement of the 2010s was.. a scam.

You're just missing the whole point of why you need n>1 instances. You're focusing on what might be the least compelling reason for the majority of applications, which is scalability.

Reliability and fault tolerance is a major selling point, and you can't simply expect to have adequate performance in more than one region if you're providing your services out of a single box in a single data center. The laws of physics ensure your quality of service will suck.

Operations also compell you to have multiple instances, ranging from blue/green deployments to one-box deployment strategies. And are you going to allow your business to be down for significant amounts of time whenever you need to update your OS? How would you explain all that downtime to your boss/shareholders? Are the tens of dollars you save on infrastructure a good tradeoff?

Also, security is also a concern. You're better off isolating your backend from frontend services, and software-defined networks aren't a silver bullet.

And in the end, are the tradeoffs of not designing your web services the right way really worth it?

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#267

Post by usr1106 »

stu2b50 wrote: post #87
lopkeny12ko wrote: post #59

I don't understand the hype around ARM64 in the server space. Is this just due to all the marketing from Apple around their proprietary M processors leaking into the enterprise market? The latest Xeon and EPYC offerings are very performance competitive, I doubt we need to overhaul and entire processor ISA paradigm for continued improvements.

The hype is because Intel and AMD have an enforced duopoly of x86, because only they own the licenses to x86-64 and you'll take it from their cold dead hands. So, if you want to compete, you'll have to go ARM. Amazon graviton and Apples M series have only made it more appealing. The main reason to switch is cost.

The ARM server hype was 10 years ago. Every Linux distro wanted to be first, but then they all waited for the year of the ARM server.

Nice to see that things seem to start moving a bit now. Energy consumption and cooling are major concerns for data centers. ARM is just so much better when it comes to energy consumption. So the potential should be there.

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#268

Post by simplotek »

MagicMoonlight wrote: post #217
zackmorris wrote: post #209

I implemented a Virtual Private Cloud (VPC) on AWS with Elastic Container Service (ECS) using Terraform so that I could run Docker, and it ended up being about 2 orders of magnitude more expensive than Hetzner after all of the services were configured. For example, something as simple as AWS NAT Gateway costs $30 per month, and it can be challenging to get everything right if you don't use one. I haven't tried Heroku…

Isn’t this entire site run off a laptop in someone’s shed? And yet it’s got basically perfect uptime. Whereas the impenetrable cloud goes down every week and costs billions a year.

> And yet it’s got basically perfect uptime.

Some monitors indicate that hackernews has a 99.84% uptime in the past 30 days. Hardly "perfect".

https://hacker-news.statuspal.io/

Re: Hetzner Introduces ARM64 Cloud Servers

#269

Post by mmmm2 »

015a wrote: post #263
zackmorris wrote: post #209

I implemented a Virtual Private Cloud (VPC) on AWS with Elastic Container Service (ECS) using Terraform so that I could run Docker, and it ended up being about 2 orders of magnitude more expensive than Hetzner after all of the services were configured. For example, something as simple as AWS NAT Gateway costs $30 per month, and it can be challenging to get everything right if you don't use one. I haven't tried Heroku…

> I can't help but feel that the cloud infrastructure and microservice movement of the 2010s was.. a scam. I think the general consensus is that the most-root cause for why cloud infrastructure and microservice architectures matter is more People, less Technology. Its hard to hire highly experienced people, especially at the hundreds-to-thousands of engineers scale that many companies operate at. That, in isolation,…

My thought on this is we've all been trained to follow the Google approach: thousands of machines, horizontally scalable, to handle any load. But this model was developed in 2004 when they wanted to hold the entire web in memory and could afford the enormous hardware outlay.

Computers are so powerful now this may be the wrong instinct. You can mind boggling amounts of processing for say... $30,000 in hardware, and even with redundancy it would be much simpler to manage.

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