Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again • Hacker News Board

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#141

Post by CuriouslyC » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:07 PM UTC

efitz wrote: post #46

My wife is from Thailand. My father in law is a rice farmer. I’m unclear about the definition of “subsistence”, because you need more than rice to live, but he grows more than they need to eat and sells the rest to eke out a living. The questions in my mind are: 1. How expensive would these perennial rice strains be (patents)? The cost would have to be ridiculously low by western standards for rural Thai farmers to a…

You can plant the rice along with nitrogen fixers. Perennial plants get old and should be replanted periodically, so you can have a fallow period where the land is grazed to really improve fertility.

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#142

Post by tfourb » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:09 PM UTC

mardifoufs wrote: post #134

Aromasin wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To put this into context, animal agriculture is responsible for 18% of the worlds CO2 emissions, uses 83% of the world's farmland, but only produces 18% of our calories and 37% of our protein.

What % of farmland used for meat production is actually usable for something else? I don't think cattle grazes on prime land, or even mildly productive land.

It really depends on what you define as "usable". I am currently looking out of a window in the Bavarian Forest and see nice lush green meadows which would be perfectly productive under many different types of crops, but which are mostly used as pasture and meadow for hay production, because the landscape is hilly, which isn't well suited to be farmed with the heavy equipment that has become standard in i.e. corn and wheat production. This type of heavy, industrialized equipment in turn has been a type of farming heavily supported and subsidized by current agricultural policies. You could change the incentives and bring a lot of the farmland currently considered "marginal" into crop production again.

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#143

Post by tfourb » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:10 PM UTC

lm28469 wrote: post #120

lettergram wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I want a warmer atmosphere. All the UN data points to a warmer atmosphere equating to more food and higher quality of life. I concede some concern about potential feedback loops, but the reality is that earth was and still is in an ice age. Ice ages are not the norm on earth, I think it’s okay if we exit an ice age. Yes things will change, but it’ll be over decades to millennia. We’re working on carbon capture right…

> I want a warmer atmosphere. > All the UN data points to a warmer atmosphere equating to more food and higher quality of life. Globally and to a point, maybe. But that's not taking into account local effects and the millions (billion?) who'll be displaced and what comes with it Then you have ocean acidification, postivie and negative feedback that we won't be able to stop, &c. > I’m fairly confident we can fix the p…

Also, it is already a problem for billions of people every year and we haven't found a fix except emitting less CO2.

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#144

Post by arghwhat » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:17 PM UTC

wolfgangK wrote: post #139

Aromasin wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To put this into context, animal agriculture is responsible for 18% of the worlds CO2 emissions, uses 83% of the world's farmland, but only produces 18% of our calories and 37% of our protein.

I really wish there was a name (that I knew of) for this logical fallacy of using precise quantities of meaninglessly confused categories. What do you think "farmland" is ? Our ancestors who knew how to raise cattle and farm cereals for millennia were surviving on the verge of starvation : why do you think that was ? Were they so dumb they'd rather die of hunger than convert some of their grazing pastures to cereal a…

Yes, some land is not suitable for agriculture. No, this does mean that having cattle is a neutral usage as each cattle requires agriculture to feed for 3-4 years before they are slaughtered.

Yes, cattle emissions are largely from the food. No, this is not just grass that was already there and would decompose anyway - the majority of agricultural production is to feed cattle and would not be necessary without (the efficiency of raising an animal for years to get a few steaks is horrible), and even if fed naturally it significantly increases the rate of plant turnover.

Yes, meat protein is a great source of nutrition. No, it is not magically better than equivalent vegetarian nutrition. Both have diets ranging from super healthy to obesity inducing. Being carnivorous or vegetarian is itself not a significant health factor - chips and crisps are often vegan, and Big Macs contain meat.

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#145

Post by blacksmith_tb » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:21 PM UTC

wolfgangK wrote: post #139

Aromasin wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To put this into context, animal agriculture is responsible for 18% of the worlds CO2 emissions, uses 83% of the world's farmland, but only produces 18% of our calories and 37% of our protein.

I really wish there was a name (that I knew of) for this logical fallacy of using precise quantities of meaninglessly confused categories. What do you think "farmland" is ? Our ancestors who knew how to raise cattle and farm cereals for millennia were surviving on the verge of starvation : why do you think that was ? Were they so dumb they'd rather die of hunger than convert some of their grazing pastures to cereal a…

Certainly some cattle are grazed on land that would be too hilly / rocky etc. to farm. And that's not a terrible use of land, but enormous numbers of cattle are raised in feedlots, and fed cereal crops like corn (maize) which have to farmed on the better farmland, which is far less reasonable.

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#146

Post by tastyfreeze » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:21 PM UTC

ed25519FUUU wrote: post #94

tastyfreeze wrote: post #91

Not all rice needs to be grown in paddies. Paddies are primarily used for weed control as rice, as a water side plant, can tolerate root submersion where the competition can't. Some varieties do better than others as "dry land" rice. A perennial dry land rice would be a boon for small holders. A lawn could become a perennial food source. I am currently working to adapt rice varieties to my temperate environment in a…

If people want to grow food in lawn there are so many easier options than rice, such as a few large fruit trees. It’s a cultural problem that lawns are just green spaces sprayed with 2,4-d, not a technological one.

Rice, like most grains, is a grass. Replace lawn grass with grain grass and plant fruit trees. Growing food isn't a one size fits all solution. Grow what you can with the least amount of effort.

Lawns as green space will last as long as food is plentiful. Changing a lawn to food production is the first step people will take if food is not available. The culture is already changing.

https://www.foodnotlawns.com/

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#147

Post by knodi123 » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:21 PM UTC

mcdonje wrote: post #140

knodi123 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I litter frequently. Some people criticize me for it, but I rightly point out that my own litter is a tiny fraction of city-wide litter, and if I stopped, no one would even notice the difference. I'm not even the biggest contributor! Mechanized recycling trucks hoist the bins high in the air and let stuff fall into a hopper on the back, and on a windy day, every single bin they pick up produces a few pieces of litter…

I have mixed feelings about this comment. It's good satire. But that's something I expect on reddit. Over here, it seems like we're running afoul of the forum norms, and Poe's Law.

That's fair. I meant it to be taken as an invitation to explain why (or why not) personal responsibility should matter in a world where the problems are complex and have a thousand sources. But I didn't do a good enough job of couching it that way, and it certainly pissed off the person I was replying to. I guess the responsible thing to do at this point is bail.

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#148

Post by sdwr » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:25 PM UTC

chris_va wrote: post #18

(disclaimer that I manage a climate group, but not a rice expert) They touch on, but don't get into the details on one of the more interesting aspects of perennial rice. Rice fields are actually a huge emitter of methane. Depending on the accounting, they contribute as much to global warming as the aviation sector. The fields emit methane when flooded, the stagnant water gets oxygen depleted, and the biomass in the s…

I believe that flooding rice fields has a substantial positive impact on yields, and not just by combating weeds. Controlled flooding creates the perfect moisture + nutrient environment.

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#149

Post by aaronblohowiak » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:30 PM UTC

gregwebs wrote: post #137

Aromasin wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To put this into context, animal agriculture is responsible for 18% of the worlds CO2 emissions, uses 83% of the world's farmland, but only produces 18% of our calories and 37% of our protein.

A lot of grazing is done on marginal farming land. For example land that is very dry or land that is very steep. So generally a statistic like 83% of the world's farmland doesn't make any sense. Not sure if it is possible to count factory farming properly- that takes really good farmland and sends the production to animals.

a lot of rainforest deforestation is for cattle

Re: Perennial rice: Plant once, harvest again and again

#150

Post by efields » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:31 PM UTC

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #131

There are a surprising number of perennial food plants. Not just bushes and trees; vegetable crops too! I recently saw a Gardeners' World episode which showcased a lady with 220+ perennial vegetables in her garden. Including a variety of broccoli, and one of chard! A surprise to me. A benefit to her is, she could have all that without dealing with every plant, every year. But she had plenty of rain and land. Not ever…

Certain crops we grow annually will perennialuse just fine in the right environment. We bought a perennial kale last year only to have it completely die, meanwhile a kale I didn’t pull at the end of the fall is shooting new leaves.

Right plant, right place. We’re still working on it, thousands of years later.