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Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

economist.com

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Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#341

Post by gdy »

atemerev wrote: post #124
jimbob45 wrote: post #5

Any Russians on here to explain why dissenters wouldn’t work on leaving the country rather than token demonstrations like this?

Sure (I am Russian, emigrated in 2005, never been in Russia since 2014). Here are some of the actual reasons: 1) Immigration is hard. Particularly when you are not from a well-developed country with a powerful passport. You will live on a borrowed time, where the host country will invent reasons to deport you (to Russia, of course, where you most probably will be jailed in no time). I live in Switzerland for 18 years…

"(to Russia, of course, where you most probably will be jailed in no time)"

Only if you publicly protest against the war.

"and you can’t go out"

Really? Lots of opposition figures emigrated from Russia since the war started.

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#342

Post by gdy »

foverzar wrote: post #238
pfisherman wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Better to be black in America than Russian in Russia. We got our problems over here, but at least we aren’t being conscripted and thrown into the meat grinder of a pointless war.

> being conscripted and thrown into the meat grinder I will be labeled as a brainwashed ruskie and downvoted into oblivion if I point out that it isn't really true, right?

I'm Russian living in Russia and it is really true.

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#343

Post by gdy »

jnsaff2 wrote: post #336
medo-bear wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i know plenty of ukranians that left ukraine in order to dodge conscription. although they hope russia looses they say they would not give their life for benefit of the corrupt elite. to me that is a smart decision. same for russians that leave russia in order to escape conscription. this war sucks as do all sides supporting it

russia is the only side supporting the war, russia can fuck off from Ukraine any time it wants and the war will be over immediately.

"russia can fuck off from Ukraine any time it wants and the war will be over immediately"

You mean leaving the people of the Crimea, DNR and LNR to the mercy of nationalistic Ukraine?

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#344

Post by jnsaff2 »

gdy wrote: post #343
jnsaff2 wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

russia is the only side supporting the war, russia can fuck off from Ukraine any time it wants and the war will be over immediately.

"russia can fuck off from Ukraine any time it wants and the war will be over immediately" You mean leaving the people of the Crimea, DNR and LNR to the mercy of nationalistic Ukraine?

Saving the people of occupied territories from russian rape, murder, forceful deportation, looting of property, etc.

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#345

Post by gdy »

d23 wrote: post #209

How depressing it must be to have lived through the collapse of the soviet union, realize the magnitude of lies, see the hope of a new Russia, and then have to go through this.

"How depressing it must be to have lived through the collapse of the soviet union"

Unless you were among millions who simply died in the 'democratic' 90s [0].

"Mortality increased substantially after the economic crisis in 1998, with life expectancy falling to 58.9 years among men and 71.8 years among women by 2001. Most of these fluctuations were due to changes in mortality from vascular disease and violent deaths (mainly suicides, homicides, unintentional poisoning, and traffic incidents) among young and middle aged adults. Trends were similar in all parts of Russia. An extra 2.5-3 million Russian adults died in middle age in the period 1992-2001 than would have been expected based on 1991 mortality."

And what was depressing was seeing the magnitude of Western lies and the disillusionment that followed.

[0] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC259165/

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#346

Post by medo-bear »

jnsaff2 wrote: post #340
medo-bear wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i don't think you speak for all ukranians though https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/4/21/whats-behind-pro-ru...

so you are saying that the so-called "separatists" form a different "side" from russia tho they both want the war to continue?

nothing "so-called" about them. by all definitions of the word, they are separatists, and ones who support russia's intervention. by their account, zelensky can end the war immediately by recognizing independence of donbas, or initiating a referendum

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#347

Post by jnsaff2 »

medo-bear wrote: post #346
jnsaff2 wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

so you are saying that the so-called "separatists" form a different "side" from russia tho they both want the war to continue?

nothing "so-called" about them. by all definitions of the word, they are separatists, and ones who support russia's intervention. by their account, zelensky can end the war immediately by recognizing independence of donbas, or initiating a referendum

If the goal is to recognize Donbas then why the fuck were the tanks rolling towards Kyiv? Why was Odesa bombed? Why did the annexation involve two other regions?

Let alone that it is public knowledge that the "separatists" are and always have been under russian control. Little green men came from russia and made the war happen.

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#348

Post by jnsaff2 »

medo-bear wrote: post #339
jnsaff2 wrote: post #335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> given the disastrous policies of the ukranian government Do you point out the policy of not letting it's people genocided without a fight? Or do you mean something else? I don't this is even up for the government to decide, Ukrainians would fight no matter their governments policy. > especially the rampant xenophobia Please don't project your own mentality onto others.

> Ukrainians would fight no matter their governments policy is that why they prevent all men from leaving their country? > Please don't project your own mentality onto others Mine? The founder of Azov, Andriy Biletsky declared in 2010 that the Ukrainian nation’s mission was to “lead the white races of the world in a final crusade … against Semite-led Untermenschen [subhumans].” There are now streets in Ukraine that c…

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdhsPQEX0AALM9H?format=jpg&name=...

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#349

Post by medo-bear »

jnsaff2 wrote: post #347
medo-bear wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nothing "so-called" about them. by all definitions of the word, they are separatists, and ones who support russia's intervention. by their account, zelensky can end the war immediately by recognizing independence of donbas, or initiating a referendum

If the goal is to recognize Donbas then why the fuck were the tanks rolling towards Kyiv? Why was Odesa bombed? Why did the annexation involve two other regions? Let alone that it is public knowledge that the "separatists" are and always have been under russian control. Little green men came from russia and made the war happen.

seperatists are eastern ukranians that dont want to be under central kiev government, run by ukranian nationalists with nazi sympathies. that they would rather see themselves as russian just goes to tell you how much of a failure the right wing policies of the ukranian government have been

Re: Russia is persecuting dissenters by taking away their children

#350

Post by medo-bear »

jnsaff2 wrote: post #344
gdy wrote: post #343

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"russia can fuck off from Ukraine any time it wants and the war will be over immediately" You mean leaving the people of the Crimea, DNR and LNR to the mercy of nationalistic Ukraine?

Saving the people of occupied territories from russian rape, murder, forceful deportation, looting of property, etc.

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