Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits • Hacker News Board

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#271

Post by rozal » Thu, Apr 06, 2023, 12:37 AM UTC

johnnyjeans wrote: post #267

rozal wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Methamphetamine is not a substitution for amphetamine. A substitution refers to the replacement of one atom or group of atoms in a molecule with another atom or group of atoms. A derivative, on the other hand, refers to a molecule that is derived from another molecule by modifying its molecular structure. In the case of amphetamine and methamphetamine, methamphetamine is derived from amphetamine by adding a methyl gr…

Did you write this post with a chatbot? > Methamphetamine is not a substitution for amphetamine. I did not say it was a "substitution" which means something entirely different in this context, I said it was a substituted amphetamine. The rest of this comment reads like boilerplate drivel that completely ignores everything I actually wrote.

Still causes psychosis.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#272

Post by bitwize » Thu, Apr 06, 2023, 10:25 AM UTC

romwell wrote: post #218

bitwize wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a clue: compare the income and SES of opiate addicts vs Adderall addicts. Which socioeconomic group is the average Hackernews more likely to fall into?

"Adderall addicts" Thanks for reminding me which medication[1] I forgot to take... again. My ADHD[3] must've made me very addicted to Adderall, huh. Perhaps consider that people with ADHD tend to thrive in creative professions , especially if they allow an opportunity to hyperfocus (the disorder is named awfully[2]), have somewhat flexible schedules, and excel in emergencies / high stress situations. That's to stay,…

I don't count people with ADHD taking Adderall as prescribed as Adderall addicts, the same way I don't count people who are on prescription morphine to manage pain, and are careful about their usage, opiate addicts.

The fact is that people use ADHD medications recreationally, or off-label to increase their focus e.g. in preparation for exams, in knowledge work, etc. And those people are at high risk of developing addiction.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#273

Post by brazzledazzle » Thu, Apr 06, 2023, 10:09 PM UTC

rozal wrote: post #175

chrisco255 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you conflating Adderall with all or any stimulants? Might as well throw in caffeine and sugar as things that "even at low doses increase the dopamine in the brain and lead to a mild high". Not disagreeing with you wrt atomexetine but really should compare apples to apples.

Adderall is an amphetamine. It's a hard drug. And methamphetamine are closely related. Taking small doses of this, essentially macrodosing, it's not good in the long term.

The long term health impacts of taking prescription stimulants at recommended doses for on-label management of disorders is well understood and extensively studied/documented. There's not a psychiatrist that's not going to take this and other factors into consideration when prescribing it and any decent one is going to discuss medication breaks with their patients they prescribe them to. Prescription stimulants aren't perfect but it's currently the most effective treatment that's broadly applicable and well-tolerated.

A lot of people are critical of prescription stimulants without presenting a comparable alternative that will allow disordered people (particularly adults) to maintain the ability to function, be productive and maintain happiness in our current society with it's expectations and capability requirements.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#274

Post by brazzledazzle » Thu, Apr 06, 2023, 10:20 PM UTC

operatingthetan wrote: post #57

brazzledazzle wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience people who take adderall while partying do it to stay awake longer to party with other drugs or booze. In practice for most people that “high” isn’t really a thing. At least not with anyone I know who is prescribed it or sometimes takes it recreationally. Meth on the other hand? Yeah that’s going to give you a very noticeable high.

Please browse https://www.reddit.com/r/StopSpeeding/ (probably nsfw) for many stories of people struggling with prescription stimulant abuse. These people aren't taking it because it keeps them up longer for drinking.

I'm not denying that you can abuse prescription stimulants by taking large doses to get high but most people aren't taking 10-30mg a day and experiencing meth like feelings of euphoria. Especially with extended release formulations. It's also much harder to maintain the regular abuse of a prescription stimulant without resorting to illicit acquisition since most psychiatrists avoid prescribing high enough doses to make that feasible.

I can't speak for every person who abuses prescription stimulants but I've met people that do and they always had a meth or other addiction in their past and were either buying from dealers or seeing multiple doctors/pharmacies. It's been a while since I've run into someone with that problem though so I don't even know if the latter strategy is effective anymore. I assume the feds maintain some kind of database these days.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#275

Post by rozal » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 12:42 AM UTC

brazzledazzle wrote: post #273

rozal wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adderall is an amphetamine. It's a hard drug. And methamphetamine are closely related. Taking small doses of this, essentially macrodosing, it's not good in the long term.

The long term health impacts of taking prescription stimulants at recommended doses for on-label management of disorders is well understood and extensively studied/documented. There's not a psychiatrist that's not going to take this and other factors into consideration when prescribing it and any decent one is going to discuss medication breaks with their patients they prescribe them to. Prescription stimulants aren'…

The alternative is easting healthy organic foods, pasture raised meats, and exercise. Even weed/DMT/LSD is loads better than 'adhd' medication - and might actually change your way of thinking.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#276

Post by ultrarunner » Fri, Apr 07, 2023, 7:00 PM UTC

ufmace wrote: post #227

ultrarunner wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://reason.com/2009/09/28/hoosier-grandmother-arrested-f...

This outrage-bait is curiously at odds with the sentiment in the sibling post by /u/fnordfnordfnord. Do you want front-level employees to judge whether somebody "look like a person who would manufacturer amphetamines" or not? If the answer is yes, then people who look sketchy in some random pharmacy worker's opinion are the only ones to get arrested, whether or not they're actually up to anything. If the answer is no…

Personally, no, I don't really want front-level employees refusing to sell sinus medication on a whim. It doesn't really work for alcohol (i.e. it doesn't stop kids from getting alcohol, but does create headaches for adults). Alcohol is, in aggregate, probably more destructive to society.

But it's also wrong to arrest grandmothers on drug charges and send them through the system for a violation of some legislator's arbitrary limit. Turns out it didn't solve the meth problem, but it did make the world a little worse to live in.

Also, I think describing the article as "outrage-bait" is in poor taste for this site. A different implication might be that when criminal charges are tied to an action with the intent of limiting an activity, those charges will inevitably be applied to "the wrong people" (maybe you?) for a different activity, and that we should be skeptical of problem-solving-through-force.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#277

Post by the_mar » Wed, Apr 12, 2023, 12:11 AM UTC

throwaway1851 wrote: post #265

drw85 wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How familiar does the following sound to you? "I've had some back pain and got prescribed opiates, now i'm addicted" We're not talking about getting some opiates after surgery or severe and mostly rare things. Americans get opiates for all kinds of small inconveniences, like a wisdom tooth removal, or some back pain. Opiates don't heal or fix back pains. They just mask the symptoms and create a new problem. I've been…

I’ve had opiates for wisdom tooth extraction and a couple of relatively minor but very painful injuries. I was very glad to have them. They made the experiences much more bearable. I did not experience any addiction issues, and I’m glad that my access to these medications was not limited due to some people’s inability to handle them. I really don’t think forcing needless suffering on everyone is the answer to this pr…

Opiates for wisdom teeth extraction are entirely unnecessary.

Source: had six very painful teeth extractions, with bone grafts and two sinus repairs. I was almost pain-free on 600mg ibuprofen + 600mg acetaminophen every 6 or so hours. I say "almost" because I was not dumb enough to try any type of exercise, or eating crunchy cereal, but I had no problem falling and staying asleep or going back to work in 24 hours.

So I am not entirely sure why you think opiates were necessary or provided you the type of relief that OTC meds could not provide. My double-board-certified, extremely expensive dental surgeon doesn't seem to think so.

I also had abdominal surgery, for which I can concur opiates do help quite a bit, which is entirely separate story.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#278

Post by A7C3D5 » Sun, Apr 16, 2023, 2:10 PM UTC

the_mar wrote: post #251

renewiltord wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ibuprofen is a poor substitute for opioids. You can keep your life and I think I'll accept the opioid crisis then, if the trade off is what you say. Some other people may die, but that is a price I'm willing to pay.

You what? Did you really just say “other people may die but that is a price I’m willing to pay”? Like you’re in charge of who dies and who lives or something

Oh I absolutely agree with him. The opioid crisis is tragic but denying people medication for their injuries, illnesses, mental health (adhd) in a completely ineffective attempt to curb a crisis that is mainly caused by the importation of cheap fentanyl analogs is the greater of two evils.

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#279

Post by A7C3D5 » Mon, Apr 17, 2023, 8:05 AM UTC

bitwize wrote: post #272

romwell wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Adderall addicts" Thanks for reminding me which medication[1] I forgot to take... again. My ADHD[3] must've made me very addicted to Adderall, huh. Perhaps consider that people with ADHD tend to thrive in creative professions , especially if they allow an opportunity to hyperfocus (the disorder is named awfully[2]), have somewhat flexible schedules, and excel in emergencies / high stress situations. That's to stay,…

I don't count people with ADHD taking Adderall as prescribed as Adderall addicts, the same way I don't count people who are on prescription morphine to manage pain, and are careful about their usage, opiate addicts. The fact is that people use ADHD medications recreationally, or off-label to increase their focus e.g. in preparation for exams, in knowledge work, etc. And those people are at high risk of developing add…

you don't care about their addiction, you care about casting moral judgement on people who take drugs you don't like

Re: Xanax and Adderall Access Is Being Blocked by Secret Drug Limits

#280

Post by A7C3D5 » Mon, Apr 17, 2023, 8:17 AM UTC

OkayPhysicist wrote: post #243

flangola7 wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where would leftovers come from?

Most ADD individuals skip doses periodically. Sometimes because they forget (we're treating an illness that causes you to get distracted, remember), or they slept in on the weekend and don't want to mess up their sleep schedule, or they simply don't have anything they really need to be able to pay attention to that day, or maybe they don't need their second dose in the day that particular day. Unlike, say, antidepres…

do you understand how often there are issues filling one's adhd prescription on time even before the shortage? Almost every month the pharmacy is out of stock for a couple days. Very few people sell their couple of extra pills, they are saved for the inevitable delays in filling scripts.

And honestly? Why is this even being discussed, as if college kids getting adderall to study for math tests is some societal scourge ruining lives or something? Who gives a shit and why is it an issue that justifies making life difficult for people who are prescribed it?