Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is also total bullshit. A fuel cell car is also an EV . Toyota is pursuing because it is the simply the better idea. People who repeat this bullshit are just brainwashed Tesla fans.
If you have to resort to semantics in an argument to make your point, you've already lost.
Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
201–210 of 218 posts
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#202Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is total bullshit. Hydrogen is fundamentally necessary to a green economy. You literally couldn't reach zero emissions without it for industry and energy storage. Same is true of transportation in nearly every sector. People are only sorta excusing it for personal transport but only because rich people can make do with battery cars. But in reality, it's practically necessary for personal transportation too. Not…
Nothing I've said is bullshit, let alone the post in totality. Feel free to point out a specific claim I've made that you believe is bullshit, and we'll proceed from there.
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#203Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why is it so easy to spot the right winger these days? Oh that's right, it's because you all parrot the same nonsense. The valuable materials in EV batteries don't get used up - they're still in the battery, and can be recycled. We haven't figured out the particulars, but there's no reason why it can't be done. In fact, the biggest issue that battery recyclers are facing right now is a lack of batteries to recycle. S…
And what is hydrogen but fuel made from water? Far less raw materials than could ever be achieved with batteries. And you'll never have to mine it even once. Seriously, the battery people act exactly like climate change deniers. An entire argument based on denying or obfuscating the problem, and pretending nothing better could ever exist. Seriously, your whole post is projection.
98% of H2 is made from fossil fuels.
You know why, right?
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#204Earlier quoted context omitted.
And what is hydrogen but fuel made from water? Far less raw materials than could ever be achieved with batteries. And you'll never have to mine it even once. Seriously, the battery people act exactly like climate change deniers. An entire argument based on denying or obfuscating the problem, and pretending nothing better could ever exist. Seriously, your whole post is projection.
>And what is hydrogen but fuel made from water? 98% of H2 is made from fossil fuels. You know why, right?
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#205Earlier quoted context omitted.
Strikes me that H2 made from excess solar panel output, at source, might become a thing. If you have enough solar for your needs then you're over-producing when the sun is at its peak. With feed in tariffs being low it makes sense to use this -- and hydrogen vehicles are an option.
> Strikes me that H2 made from excess solar panel output, at source, might become a thing. Why is that better than putting it back into the grid and/or putting it into a battery?
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#206Earlier quoted context omitted.
>And what is hydrogen but fuel made from water? 98% of H2 is made from fossil fuels. You know why, right?
So is the vast majority of electricity. Take away hydropower and nuclear, and it's something like 85%. Use to be 99% at one point.
H2 is already expensive when reformed from natural gas - you can expect to pay 20-30 cents per mile to travel in the most advanced, fuel efficient H2 vehicle out there.
https://www.hydrogeninsight.com/transport/exclusive-fresh-bl...
H2 made via electrolysis is a bit more than 3x that cost. Are you ready to pay $1 per mile to drive?
Of course, price generally declines with volume, so we could expect those numbers to come down if H2 were more widely adopted. But there is a thermodynamic floor on the cost of H2, which means that it will never be cost-competitive with pure electric vehicles.
https://medium.com/10x-curiosity/the-hydrogen-hopium-ea11c7a...
And then there's the complexity issue. As a former fuel cell engineer, I understand better than most how complex and finicky proton exchange membrane fuel cell systems are. They are easily poisoned, they're prone to freezing, they have long startup times, they require high-speed, expensive electric air compressors, and they have complex valving and sensors to ensure safe operation.
Purely electric vehicles simply do not have these problems. A battery and a motor is about as simple as a drivetrain can possibly be. EVs will always be fundamentally far simpler than FCEVs, which translates into a lower upfront vehicle cost.
You have no answer to these problems.
I suggest you stop furiously responding here and instead consider your biases, and reevaluate your position. Batteries are so much better than H2 for transportation on just about all fronts that the two are not even close to comparable. H2 at this point is a malicious distraction being foisted on the general public by oil companies attempting to stay relevant, and governments engaging in sunk cost fallacious thinking. The sooner fuel cells for transport (and H2 for heating) are relegated to history's dustbin, the better.
Oh, and as for your assertion that electricity sans nuclear and hydro is 85% fossil fuels... that's true... and irrelevant. 40% of electricity generated in the US today is renewable, and that number grows steadily each year. We would be absolutely foolish to use that electricity to crack water, compress the H2, transport the H2, and convert it back to electricity in fuel cells, losing 65% of the energy in the process, than simply using it directly via batteries. Come on man! Discard the propaganda, separate your emotions from your positions, and think for yourself!
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#207Earlier quoted context omitted.
Nothing I've said is bullshit, let alone the post in totality. Feel free to point out a specific claim I've made that you believe is bullshit, and we'll proceed from there.
Millions of tons of hydrogen is used in industry. Serious incidents are rare. Not to mention there hasn't been a single hydrogen car that has exploded or whatever (something that can't be said of BEVs). So just from that your argument is just lazy fearmongering and FUD.
>Serious incidents are rare.
Even so, they're probably more common than you think. Google it.
>there hasn't been a single hydrogen car that has exploded
Uh... google "hydrogen car explosion."
>So just from that your argument is just lazy fearmongering and FUD.
So far, every point you've made has been weak or outright incorrect. Meanwhile, you have yet to seriously challenge any point I've made.
The reason for this isn't that I'm better at this than you. Your position is simply untenable.
I hope you figure out how to account for the bias that so obviously pervades your thought process. Cheers, I guess.
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#208Earlier quoted context omitted.
So is the vast majority of electricity. Take away hydropower and nuclear, and it's something like 85%. Use to be 99% at one point.
98% of H2 is made from fossil fuels because cracking water is very expensive. H2 is already expensive when reformed from natural gas - you can expect to pay 20-30 cents per mile to travel in the most advanced, fuel efficient H2 vehicle out there. https://www.hydrogeninsight.com/transport/exclusive-fresh-bl... H2 made via electrolysis is a bit more than 3x that cost. Are you ready to pay $1 per mile to drive? Of cours…
A fuel cell is also an electrochemical system. An FCEV is also an EV. Same electric motors and everything. They can attain the same level of efficiency as a li-ion battery and not any more complex. Less complex even, if you seriously analyze the complexity of the battery pack. And because of that, it can easily displace BEVs.
I don't know your background, but your writing is that of a bullshit artist. It completely ignores basic facts and substitute BEV propaganda.
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#209Earlier quoted context omitted.
Millions of tons of hydrogen is used in industry. Serious incidents are rare. Not to mention there hasn't been a single hydrogen car that has exploded or whatever (something that can't be said of BEVs). So just from that your argument is just lazy fearmongering and FUD.
Industry is very good at mitigating risks with procedures and detection. Homeowners, not so much. >Serious incidents are rare. Even so, they're probably more common than you think. Google it. >there hasn't been a single hydrogen car that has exploded Uh... google "hydrogen car explosion." >So just from that your argument is just lazy fearmongering and FUD. So far, every point you've made has been weak or outright inc…
Sorry, but you are a liar. Your attitude is just a mask for your BS.
Re: Solid-State Battery Has 2x the Energy–and No Anode
#210Earlier quoted context omitted.
So is the vast majority of electricity. Take away hydropower and nuclear, and it's something like 85%. Use to be 99% at one point.
98% of H2 is made from fossil fuels because cracking water is very expensive. H2 is already expensive when reformed from natural gas - you can expect to pay 20-30 cents per mile to travel in the most advanced, fuel efficient H2 vehicle out there. https://www.hydrogeninsight.com/transport/exclusive-fresh-bl... H2 made via electrolysis is a bit more than 3x that cost. Are you ready to pay $1 per mile to drive? Of cours…
Do you see BEV becoming the dominant truck technology?
If FCEV trucks were to take off as a technology and get to a share of say 30 % of all trucks in some region, then I'd speculate that the FCEV tech in itself would ultimately displace BEV not only in the truck but also partially in the car sector.