AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will • Hacker News Board

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#311

Post by [deleted] » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:07 PM UTC

fnovd wrote: post #279

gavinhoward wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Username checks out because you missed the point. Yes, I know calculators can encourage people to not think; I should know because I wrote one. [1] But the current "AI" tech is so much worse on that front. It's a difference of degree, and that degree does matter. By the way, when I was learning to fly helicopters [2], I used my calculator to calculate weight and balances, but I also did it by hand! [1]: https://git.g…

I'm sure that all was very rewarding for you. I'm not sure how it translates into a business. We don't want to teach accountants to deploy their own calculator from the command line and we don't want pilots to do math while they're flying. You act like encouraging people not to think is a problem. Thing is, you'd be wrong. We want people not just to think, but to focus. If I'm a pilot and I have to worry about the ru…

[deleted]

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#312

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:07 PM UTC

fnimick wrote: post #261

baremetal wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are very likely in the top 5% of earners. Top 5% of Earners $342,987[1] [1] https://www.investopedia.com/personal-finance/how-much-incom...

No, I'm not. I'm not even in the top 10%. Also, we can be concerned for people less fortunate than us. "You're probably wealthy so why do you care" is such a stupid argument.

I will add even more to this point. If anything, people who are more fortunate have an actual incentive to ensure some level of care for those less fortunate even if it is just for purely selfish reasons. Hungry people are angry people and the moment there is a lot of hungry, angry people, being top 10% is unlikely to keep you or your wealth safe. There are obviously non-pragmatic considerations, but I am trying to appeal to self-preservation instinct.

Sure. Some don't care, but I sometimes wonder if those people understand that living in society means some level of acceptable balance to all.

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#313

Post by syzarian » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:08 PM UTC

baremetal wrote: post #240

klodolph wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think policing analogies is serving the conversation well. Someone whose job disappears in a puff of smoke doesn’t have a reason to care about whether the job was automated or whether it was moved overseas—in both cases, the economic activity is still there (or more likely, it’s increased), but the workers who trained for it are no longer getting compensated, and our concerns are for the welfare of these work…

>If you take a look at the US manufacturing sector, the output is higher than ever You are incorrect. S&P Global US Manufacturing PMI Final March 49.2, down from flash print at 49.3, but up from the 47.3 in Feb - that is the 5th straight month of contraction (sub-50) ISM Manufacturing March dropped to 46.3, from 47.7, and below 47.5 expectations - that is the 5th straight monthly contraction to the lowest since May 2…

I think parent is saying we manufacture more today in the U.S. than we did 30 years or so ago with fewer people.

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#314

Post by gavinhoward » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:08 PM UTC

fnovd wrote: post #279

gavinhoward wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Username checks out because you missed the point. Yes, I know calculators can encourage people to not think; I should know because I wrote one. [1] But the current "AI" tech is so much worse on that front. It's a difference of degree, and that degree does matter. By the way, when I was learning to fly helicopters [2], I used my calculator to calculate weight and balances, but I also did it by hand! [1]: https://git.g…

I'm sure that all was very rewarding for you. I'm not sure how it translates into a business. We don't want to teach accountants to deploy their own calculator from the command line and we don't want pilots to do math while they're flying. You act like encouraging people not to think is a problem. Thing is, you'd be wrong. We want people not just to think, but to focus. If I'm a pilot and I have to worry about the ru…

You don't know much about aviation, do you?

Aviation is about redundancy. Redundancy is a good use of a pilot's focus. That's why I did both. I didn't blindly trust my calculator to not have bugs (even though I wrote it!), and I didn't blindly trust my hand calculations to be correct.

If they agree, though, it's a good sign that everything is in good order. That's what redundancy is for, to ensure that a problem in one thing does not lead to another problem, like in the Swiss cheese model of accidents.

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#315

Post by Herval_freire » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:08 PM UTC

dahart wrote: post #304

schwartzworld wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> A drug addict did have a choice, and exercised it, and addiction was the consequence This sort of disregards the large percentage of people who get hooked on drugs while recovering from injuries or medical issues. After marijuana, pain killers are the second most abused illegal substance.

That’s fair, you’re totally right. But, this is exposing why the drug addict analogy isn’t a great analogy relative to use of AI. I went along with it to find common ground, but I don’t believe the existence of drug addicts are evidence that we lack any choice when it comes to building, deploying, or using AI, like @Herval_freire implied. Do you? I think we do have the freedom to exercise caution, or regulate the use…

We lack choice in aggregate. As an individual you have the choice of doing a drug. If I talk about a population of people and I introduce highly addictive drugs to a population of people, then it's almost a guarantee that part of that population will get addicted. In this sense it is not a choice.

For AI, if I introduce AI to a population of people then for sure part of the population will exploit and use AI. Logically speaking in order to compete, others will have to start using it as well.

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#316

Post by theonlybutlet » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:08 PM UTC

golergka wrote: post #209

ajmurmann wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Comparing to outsourcing or, even less fitting, immigration is a terrible analogy. Those jobs and their income go to other humans. Other humans who will consume goods and services, this is especially true for immigration. I'd also argue that offshoring is morally positive because it moves the work and associated income to where people need it more, that's why the labor is cheaper there Both automation and global move…

> However, automation allows for the owner of the goods of production to retain much more of the value created. Owners of means of productions are typically american people with 401k or other pensions funds. There's nothing wrong to provide good returns for regular people.

Wealth has become increasingly concentrated in the states over the last 20 years, to the point where that statement doesn't hold anymore.

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#317

Post by the_lonely_road » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:08 PM UTC

tricksforfree wrote: post #122

yieldcrv wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I started a business over the last week and I Rapidly iterated domain names with chatgpt Did logo mockups in midjourney AI Did website list mockups in midjourney AI Rapidly iterated copy and cool sounding text with ChatGPT Got font faces and style guides with ChatGPT Got landing page code in React with ChatGPT I can code. I would have been distracted by juggling all of the designers that I hired, so distracted that I…

Why did you use React for landing page?

Not the OP but I use React for all my small projects. I do it because it’s the right tool for the job. Why is it the right tool? Because I seems 40 hours a week working with mammoth React projects and therefore its the tool I can “just be productive” in. When working in side projects it’s critical for me to maximize time spent working on the business logic rather than reading documentation on some new tool and googling new error messages to figure out what I didn’t glue together correctly.

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#318

Post by gavinhoward » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:09 PM UTC

Closi wrote: post #305

gavinhoward wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Username checks out because you missed the point. Yes, I know calculators can encourage people to not think; I should know because I wrote one. [1] But the current "AI" tech is so much worse on that front. It's a difference of degree, and that degree does matter. By the way, when I was learning to fly helicopters [2], I used my calculator to calculate weight and balances, but I also did it by hand! [1]: https://git.g…

I think you missed their point - calculators don't exist in accountancy firms to 'encourage accountants not to think', they exist because they dramatically speed up accountancy and make accountants more productive. Sure you can open an accountancy business and refuse to use calculators, but that's just working with a strange self-imposed limit rather than using technology to best support your business.

And you missed my point.

Yes, calculators do that. I'm arguing that "AI" does not let programmers write better code faster. It lets them write worse code faster, or better code slower.

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#319

Post by eloff » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:09 PM UTC

gavinhoward wrote: post #300

eloff wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re going to develop this software in house and not allow your engineers to use AI in that process? That’s not only unenforceable, it’s business suicide.

I don't have employees, never will. Pretty easy to enforce if it's just me.

I guess if you never grow that much. I don’t know why you would purposefully handicap yourself by not taking advantage of the tools available. Why make yourself less competitive?

Re: AI won't steal your job, people leveraging AI will

#320

Post by theonlybutlet » Mon, Apr 03, 2023, 4:10 PM UTC

the_doctah wrote: post #253

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please give some examples then. I've found the GPT-4 version to be remarkably accurate, and when it makes mistakes it's not hard to spot them. For example, I commented last week that I've found ChatGPT to be a great tool for managing my task list, and for whatever reason the "verbal" back-and-forth works much better for my brain than a simple checklist-based todo app: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35390644 . B…

For a time, I was attempting to use it for game advice during my recent playthrough of Demon's Souls remake (What's the best build for X? What's the best weapon for X?). I asked ChatGPT where to find the NPC The Filthy Woman in a certain level. ChatGPT answered that that NPC doesn't exist, and perhaps I had the wrong game? That NPC most certainly does exist. I was also using it to generate some Java code for a bit. T…

Out of curiosity was this 3.5 or 4?