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The day Windows died

thomasbandt.com

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Re: The day Windows died

#301

Post by hparadiz »

judge2020 wrote: post #274
hparadiz wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't really get why you keep playing the contrarian in this thread. Linux works for me for all the games I play. I get incredible performance. And the anti cheat stuff I don't really care about. I used to play CS 1.6 and there were cheaters sure but it didn't really change my ability to be a PC games enjoyer. I'm not gonna read your comment and be like "omg he's right. my linux install sucks. back to winblows". I…

I'm not playing the contrarian just to do so, I'm noting that there is a potential correlation between "allows linux users (AKA relaxed requirements / a lower baseline for cheating assurance)" and a higher percentage of cheaters in their game. At the start of both Valorant and Overwatch's lifetimes, it was effectively impossible to find a cheater in a PC match, and even now there isn't much evidence for there being w…

You haven't actually offered any evidence of this being the case. It's just as easy to make cheats for games on Windows as it is on Linux. In fact most cheats are made for Windows precisely because most of the people buying these cheats are using Windows.

Re: The day Windows died

#302

Post by matthew28845 »

joeman1000 wrote: post #122
qbasic_forever wrote: post #65

Setup your 10 year old with bleeding edge Arch Linux, add a script to automatically update nightly (or even hourly lol), and give them a secondary device like a tablet loaded up with access to arch wiki, every man page, etc. but nothing else. They will be an absolute Linux wizard in months and maybe a core contributor soon after.

Sounds like hell. They will quickly be turned away from Linux and want something simpler. Yak-shaving in lieu of work sounds cool, but it sucks when you really need to do stuff other than dick around in the terminal.

My first computer was a Raspberry Pi v1 that I got when I was 9 (now 19). Definitely not the case for me. I became proficient in using Linux very quickly.

Re: The day Windows died

#303

Post by Rebelgecko »

nuker wrote: post #153
jkepler wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For basic office tasks and browsing the Internet, Debian stable won't waste your time: it should just work.

Add two HiDPI monitors and you’ll see.

That's also a pathological failure case with MacBook (depending on the trim level of MacBook, you'll run into situations like only 1 monitor working. Or both monitors work, but randomly trade position when the computer wakes from sleep)

Re: The day Windows died

#304

Post by miniupuchaty »

technol0gic wrote: post #226
surgical_fire wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a long time I had Linux in Dual boot, cursing at how unfortunate it was that I couldn't really play games there. Even games that had Linux builds often had those as afterthoughts, with bugs not present in the main windows version. Now I can just play the Windows version through Proton. I hope that if Linux gains traction Proton becomes unnecessary, but I'm happy that Proton came as far as it is. Honestly, to play…

If I'm not mistaken, one of the reasons Proton is necessary is DirectX (Windows native & Proton) still does a better job of handling a lot of things than OpenGL (Linux native), so while you still see the same house (the game), the graphics foundation underneath is completely different. And say what you will about Microsoft (don't even get me staaaaaaarted), but DirectX is polished. It might even be their best product…

Industry has moved to dx12 and vulkan. With vulkan being native to win and Linux(and switch). In bigger engines you suport all of them, even opengl still. Some Indies might still use opengl due to it being simpler or for better support on the web or mobile.

With dx12 and vulkan its mostly up to what platforms do you want to support. As they do things quite similar. While you need vulkan for switch you need dx for Xbox. PS has its own API.

Tldr opengl is mostly irrelevant today for bigger titles and that's not what's blocking titles from supporting Linux.

Re: The day Windows died

#305

Post by kyrra »

ChancyChance wrote: post #289
wruza wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A contrary anecdote: I used mac for like 7 years, linux (and bsd) for around the same. Both full-commit, main system. And obviously windows, which was always somewhere in a background all this time. I settled on windows 10 and do not plan to move away from it. MSYS2 adds the linux part, because I don’t really care about kernel or fs, linux means gnu/coreutils to me. And if you like gaming, fresh or non-standard hardw…

> But at least “yes, it can do that” That's a good point. Hardware failures are far more costly on a Mac that on a windows machine. I'm so far removed from that being an issue (because I'm old) that it is a privilege I forget I have. Duly noted. Cygwin/MSYS/Mingw are really sad reflections of their source material. Not to take a big crap on the millions of man hours the developers have put into them, but they are not…

WSL2 should help some? It's not perfect, but can get you a lot of the way there.

Re: The day Windows died

#306

Post by Mike_12345 »

smcin wrote: post #88
stavros wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basically whatever runs Steam, if you want to play games.

Sure, but Steam doesn't run natively, and is very heavy on battery and GPU. So it isn't good for playing on a laptop when mobile; signficantly worse to native game binary running on a tablet or laptop.

Not true. Some games perform better on Proton (less power consumption than native). Overall no difference in power consumption.

Re: The day Windows died

#307

Post by nbzso »

Hostile personal computing is here to stay. Dark patterns are prerequisite for commercial OS nowadays. Outside the usual "work" scenario, there is no sane tech person who is not aware of this and is not using Linux. The idea that Macs are somehow better is obvious when installing Little Snitch. These are the data hoarders for the common people. My kid will know what is a terminal before it touches iPad or iPhone.

Re: The day Windows died

#309

Post by judge2020 »

hparadiz wrote: post #301
judge2020 wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not playing the contrarian just to do so, I'm noting that there is a potential correlation between "allows linux users (AKA relaxed requirements / a lower baseline for cheating assurance)" and a higher percentage of cheaters in their game. At the start of both Valorant and Overwatch's lifetimes, it was effectively impossible to find a cheater in a PC match, and even now there isn't much evidence for there being w…

You haven't actually offered any evidence of this being the case. It's just as easy to make cheats for games on Windows as it is on Linux. In fact most cheats are made for Windows precisely because most of the people buying these cheats are using Windows.

That's not what I said - my point is that companies with a relaxed security baseline (ie. not having a dedicated team of people tasked with investigating cheats and improving their anti-cheat system) tend to invite an increased number of cheaters into their games, and I back this up with real events.

- These companies will send cease-and-desist letters to cheat makers instead of working to detect their cheats (Joduska.me ceased operations due to a Riot C&D, and Bossland GmbH was actually sued and lost). If these cheats were instead detected and users banned on a continuous basis, no lawsuits would be needed.

- CS:GO implemented (as in, almost a decade ago) an "Overwatch" review system to allow players to review potential cheaters and have a consensus on whether or not cheating is likely. Valve is knows to be very relaxed on VAC - and knowing the company culture @ Valve being what it is, these ban waves probably only happen when one of the seniors @ Valve gets killed by a cheater in-game themselves and tasks someone with implementing some detection mechanism into VAC. Only recently (~4 years ago) has valve supposedly started to incorporate more advanced automatic detection and punishment systems[0], but at the time it wasn't doing anything about wallhacks and at auto-headshot cheats tend to be pretty good at adding enough noise to make it look very close to what professionals can do and thus these cases still end up in the overwatch queue (and note that this system probably hasn't been iterated on much; Valve doesn't do dedicated teams that own specific products).

Of course, there is no hard evidence for the actual number of cheaters in all of these games. But my point isn't that Linux is the vehicle or platform cheats are used on, just that a video game without a rigorous cheat detection system is more likely to open up their attack surface to other platforms. Valorant still has firepower behind it, so while there are cheats, Riot is invested in keeping it Windows-only to ensure they don't incidentally have to split their resources between detecting cheats and hardening their executables on Linux and Windows at the same time.

0: https://youtu.be/SnRgW54EWwA?t=299

Re: The day Windows died

#310

Post by judge2020 »

pxc wrote: post #198
hparadiz wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Easy anti cheat works in linux now. Most games now just work

Don't some big publishers of 'important' trendy multiplayer games with strong network effects still basically refuse to enable EAC's Linux support, though? Do you know any recent articles or blog posts summarizing the state of affairs with competitive multiplayer games rn?

Epic hasn't even enabled it for Fortnite, and UE5 definitely should enable fairly seamless Vulkan usage on other platforms (although the reasoning could be because the market is so small and Fortnite's QA team is already stretched incredibly thin)
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