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Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

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Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#21

Post by rippercushions »

capableweb wrote: post #18
lazzlazzlazz wrote: post #7

So Starlink has been so effective and so popular that — utterly unsurprisingly — it is becoming more congested and they're raising rates. This is good news and not bad. It's a strong sign that the model fundamentally works and they will be able to fund continuous improvements to meet strong demand.

The sentiment has been (up until this point?) that Starlink needs to lower costs for the customers, not increase them, as otherwise the customer base will remain as tiny as it currently is. Last I remember, the cost was ~500 USD + the monthly fee, I wonder how many in a rural environment are ready to pony that up for a measly connection. Maybe not difficult for live-on-a-farm-software-developers, but what about the r…

If Starship works out (and that's admittedly a big if), the price of launching Starlink satellites will plummet and they'll be able to boost the number of satellites in orbit from ~4k to 30k, which will improve bandwidth and cut costs.

https://spacenews.com/spacex-goes-all-in-on-starship-configu...

Also, if you think a $500 one-time fee is bad, try asking Comcast how much they'll charge for pulling 20 miles of fiber to your farm.

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#22

Post by tedk-42 »

All these talks about Starlink -> Remember it's a bandaid solution to your governments poor planning and infrastructure rollout of a core utility / service.

I say this as an Australian who watched one government plan a national rollout of fibre while another came in justifying most people don't need a connection better than 25/5 (based on usage data at the time) and went ahead and gutted the project.

We're now trying to undo the previous government's mess up of the original roll out post COVID world when everyone discovered remote work is a good idea for many.

Starlink's issue feels like history repeating itself with any service that becomes popular and goes too quickly into high demand

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#23

Post by capableweb »

Zigurd wrote: post #10
grecy wrote: post #2

Starlink was designed for, and has always been intended for remote people who literally have no other connection option. No cable, no 3G or 4G. If you can get those other options, Starlink is not a product designed for you. Go remote, and Starlink is an absolute game changer without even a remotely close equal.

Take a look at 5G extended range FWA. That's what Starlink is competing against. Proprietary versions of similar capability are well-proven, but 5G-based extended range FWA enables interoperation, standardization, and competition.

> Take a look at 5G extended range FWA.

> This innovation extends mmWave coverage from a few hundred meters to more than 7km

That doesn't seem very impressive... That doesn't even come close to what various long-range WiFi connections have been able to do.

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#24

Post by plugger »

grecy wrote: post #2

Starlink was designed for, and has always been intended for remote people who literally have no other connection option. No cable, no 3G or 4G. If you can get those other options, Starlink is not a product designed for you. Go remote, and Starlink is an absolute game changer without even a remotely close equal.

no offence, but this perspective doesn't apply worldwide. if you live in a country like Australia a StarLink connection will give you 10x the speed of many NBN (National Broadband Network) wired connections. 3G/4G/5G are metered by MB and not a viable option for a daily WAN link due to that. Unless you were lucky enough to get fibre pulled into your house before the government at the time kneecapped the NBN you'd have a link that is comparable in cost and speed. Most consumers here do not have that link.

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#25

Post by Zigurd »

capableweb wrote: post #23
Zigurd wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Take a look at 5G extended range FWA. That's what Starlink is competing against. Proprietary versions of similar capability are well-proven, but 5G-based extended range FWA enables interoperation, standardization, and competition.

> Take a look at 5G extended range FWA. > This innovation extends mmWave coverage from a few hundred meters to more than 7km That doesn't seem very impressive... That doesn't even come close to what various long-range WiFi connections have been able to do.

5G extended range FWA piggybacks off 5G infrastructure. You can do similar things with WiFi or proprietary mmWave FWA, but it requires purpose-built infrastructure.

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#26

Post by Fatnino »

ChatGTP wrote: post #16
lazzlazzlazz wrote: post #7

So Starlink has been so effective and so popular that — utterly unsurprisingly — it is becoming more congested and they're raising rates. This is good news and not bad. It's a strong sign that the model fundamentally works and they will be able to fund continuous improvements to meet strong demand.

What determines capacity isn't transparent. Also, yes it may get cheaper, but that’s not a given, if it doesn’t, what happens then?

Price comes down when meaningful competition enters the space (see what I did there?)

OneWeb seems about ready to start offering service. Remains to be seen if the offering can compete with starlink but good chance it will apply downward pressure to prices.

Then in the medium distant future there is Amazon's constellation that will have to compete with starlink v3 or v4 or whatever they're up to by then.

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#27

Post by Fatnino »

TradingPlaces wrote: post #17

$65 billion going into rural broadband over the next 5 years. Not finalized, but my read is the feds want fiber. They are wrangling over maps right now. https://www.commerce.gov/news/fact-sheets/2021/11/fact-sheet...

I'll bet 70+% of the money that ends up allocated will find its way into established isp pockets with absolutely nothing to show for it in return.

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#28

Post by MindSpunk »

plugger wrote: post #24
grecy wrote: post #2

Starlink was designed for, and has always been intended for remote people who literally have no other connection option. No cable, no 3G or 4G. If you can get those other options, Starlink is not a product designed for you. Go remote, and Starlink is an absolute game changer without even a remotely close equal.

no offence, but this perspective doesn't apply worldwide. if you live in a country like Australia a StarLink connection will give you 10x the speed of many NBN (National Broadband Network) wired connections. 3G/4G/5G are metered by MB and not a viable option for a daily WAN link due to that. Unless you were lucky enough to get fibre pulled into your house before the government at the time kneecapped the NBN you'd hav…

So much this. I'm on Starlink in Sydney because Australia's NBN decided to stop their fibre rollout 600 meters from my house and decided that the only option they would provide me is old geostationary satellite. 4G reception is middling with pathetic data caps. I get 5G reception too but none of the providers will offer home broadband services, only mobile Wifi. On Starlink I get ~250mbps down at a price only marginally higher than what I would be paying to get the same speed on a fixed line connection.

I can't be the only one in a situation like mine. Prime candidates for Starlink. The NBN closed quotes for running fibre to my residence. Even if I had the tens-of-thousands to pay for them to run the cable they won't even consider taking my money currently.

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#29

Post by cma »

TradingPlaces wrote: post #17

$65 billion going into rural broadband over the next 5 years. Not finalized, but my read is the feds want fiber. They are wrangling over maps right now. https://www.commerce.gov/news/fact-sheets/2021/11/fact-sheet...

It seems like everywhere wired up for electricity should be able to have fiber. Or are repairs still so intensive that it really needs to be buried?

Re: Starlink internet is going from rural savior to unreliable luxury

#30

Post by jlkuester7 »

rippercushions wrote: post #21
capableweb wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sentiment has been (up until this point?) that Starlink needs to lower costs for the customers, not increase them, as otherwise the customer base will remain as tiny as it currently is. Last I remember, the cost was ~500 USD + the monthly fee, I wonder how many in a rural environment are ready to pony that up for a measly connection. Maybe not difficult for live-on-a-farm-software-developers, but what about the r…

If Starship works out (and that's admittedly a big if), the price of launching Starlink satellites will plummet and they'll be able to boost the number of satellites in orbit from ~4k to 30k, which will improve bandwidth and cut costs. https://spacenews.com/spacex-goes-all-in-on-starship-configu... Also, if you think a $500 one-time fee is bad, try asking Comcast how much they'll charge for pulling 20 miles of fiber…

> Also, if you think a $500 one-time fee is bad, try asking Comcast how much they'll charge for pulling 20 miles of fiber to your farm.

Made me laugh out loud! :)

Closest wired internet to my place is 6mi South. Also have a big hill between me and the only fixed LOS internet tower in the area. Currently, Starlink is my only real option, and it has worked fine for me so far!

In my experience, an ISP with no real competition is always going to be pricy. The only way to get reasonable rates is to have some competition....

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