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What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

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Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#171

Post by simonsarris »

amelius wrote: post #135
satvikpendem wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It really isn't that simple, because again, no one really can say how it is so simple, merely that it is, somehow. Economists also talk about this point often, and they also can't agree, generally speaking, on how to, or even if to, reduce the inequality gap. The best solutions I've seen are land value taxes, inheritance and estate taxes, and taxes on loans backed by stock; and among the worst are unrealized capital…

Economists are part of the problem. When the rich are getting richer and the poor work their asses off and still get poorer, then just about any solution is better and the more decent thing to do than keeping disagreeing about what is the best solution.

this was basically the mentality that lead to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dekulakization

it did not go well. It did not go well for either the richer (murdered) people or the poorer (ensuing famine) people: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_famine_of_1930%E2%80%93...

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#172

Post by nemo44x »

Bellend wrote: post #155
watrami wrote: post #103

It seems like it's the same story everywhere I look. Housing is the main driver of inequality and there is little change happening. We have the same problem here in Germany. I am currently living in Munich to finish my CS Master's at TUM and build a startup, and it is absolutely impossible to find anything remotely affordable. I am supported by two startup scholarships and make enough to get by, but no landlord even…

I believe we are in a time where everyone is milking the 90s-20s real estate bubble and no one wants to be first to fold. Internationally, not just on a per country basis. As soon as say, French real estate collapses (or UK or USA or Germany etc), the whole rotten castle of cards will fold as well. If it doesn't you can enjoy the expensive property, but you won't be eating farmed foods, won't be in a clean environmen…

Why would it collapse? There’s insatiable demand for extreme limited property. Interest rate hikes may lower the price of property but the interest will rise proportionately.

Do people really think at sone point no one will want premium property and I’ll finally get it cheap? Of course that will never happen.

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#173

Post by listenallyall »

tptacek wrote: post #72
varispeed wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

This is a conspiracy theory about a global suit-and-tie version of TED Talks whose members consistently underperform the S&P 500. The World Economic Forum sounds important, like the IMF is, but it's nothing at all like that. It's a convention, in the ComicCon sense, that happens to be frequented by high-status people, because high-status people go where other high-status people go. Ironically, talking about them as i…

Comparing WEF specifically to ComicCon, like it's a harmless goofy diversion, is deceptively dismissive, and surely not an accident on your part.

At the very least you could compare it to an industry trade show, like an annual convention of trial attorneys or of insurance adjusters, which is a key vector for introducing and spreading new concepts and ideas in those industries.

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#174

Post by friend_and_foe »

brailsafe wrote: post #69
jdmoreira wrote: post #61

I'm in the highest percentiles of income in Sweden (public data is available) and it doesn't matter. It's basically impossible for me to afford a house / apartment for my family in the best neighborhoods. What's the point? What is the point of trying to be a high performer if wealth can't be acquired by income? Why would I want to work for anyone in this country? Only way out is equity and that game is even harder to…

I'm in Vancouver working remotely for an EU/US company because I couldn't get anything here. At $100k CAD, my partner and I wouldn't be able to afford a modest upgrade to a 1 bedroom condo... anywhere in the city (from a tiny basement studio) without significantly increasing our take home. The place I just visited would require $4000/m after a 20% down payment (which I don't have). If I double my savings in the next…

Let me ask you, you live in one of the most beautiful regions on the planet, you work remote, why don't you get a place 2 hours away from the city or something like that? Nice quiet life, the beauty of the pacific northwest not even a bike ride away, cheaper to live, and you don't have to deal with the crackheads. What keeps you in the city?

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#175

Post by dangwhy »

amrocha wrote: post #165
dangwhy wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

better in terms of costs and access, worse in terms of quality and wait times.

You can't claim "wait times" as a positive of letting a bunch of people die or go bankrupt Quality is just not true

> You can't claim "wait times" as a positive of letting a bunch of people die or go bankrupt

i already covered that under 'access' . If you have access then USA has much lower wait times. Its postive to the people who have access. Your implication that wait times are just natural consequence of more access is also not right.

"Commonwealth Fund ranked Canada last among 11 countries surveyed on wait times for specialist care. the Commonwealth Fund’s survey results show that other universal health care systems (eg, the Netherlands, Switzerland, Germany, Australia, and France) have much shorter wait times than Canada does."

"Canada has 35% fewer acute care beds and per capita than the United States ... "

> Quality is just not true

If you want the most cutting edge medical care then USA is the no 1 destination for people all over the world.

"The United States ranks 4th in the World Index of Healthcare Innovation, with an overall score of 54.96, behind only Switzerland, Germany, and the Netherlands. Americans are usually the first to gain access to major new medical advances, advances often discovered at American universities and developed by American companies. As a result, the U.S. ranked first for both Choice (57.65) and Science & Technology (75.14)."

https://freopp.org/united-states-health-system-profile-4-in-...

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#176

Post by simonsarris »

jdmoreira wrote: post #61

I'm in the highest percentiles of income in Sweden (public data is available) and it doesn't matter. It's basically impossible for me to afford a house / apartment for my family in the best neighborhoods. What's the point? What is the point of trying to be a high performer if wealth can't be acquired by income? Why would I want to work for anyone in this country? Only way out is equity and that game is even harder to…

Come to America! You might like New Hampshire: The sunshine hours of Portugal and the winters of Sweden in one.

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#178

Post by boringuser2 »

DevKoala wrote: post #145
boringuser2 wrote: post #54

Nobody likes to talk about the effect of moving large populations around globally without the housing infrastructure to support them.

Seriously. I feel people act naively on these discussions because they are afraid of offending others, but it is common sense that a ~0.3%/year influx of immigrants with low resources over 50 years has contributed in some way to economic disparity in Sweden. Nobody is saying that immigrants are having a negative effect here, it just means that newcomers have an uphill battle versus established families that have been…

Just to clarify your point, it means that the opportunity for people who were the offspring of "historic" Swedish citizens and didn't not already own or inherit substantial wealth (most people) was subtracted due to the large movements of populations.

As a result, I don't see why someone would support such a policy.

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#179

Post by nemo44x »

robocat wrote: post #131
watrami wrote: post #103

It seems like it's the same story everywhere I look. Housing is the main driver of inequality and there is little change happening. We have the same problem here in Germany. I am currently living in Munich to finish my CS Master's at TUM and build a startup, and it is absolutely impossible to find anything remotely affordable. I am supported by two startup scholarships and make enough to get by, but no landlord even…

> We are already looking to move to other places Moving doesn’t necessarily help much. That is because usually house prices are directly driven by how much people can loan on a mortgage, which is directly driven by earnings. Cheaper housing often means lower earnings potential. Conversely, saving in a high earning country can mean you have a deposit for a house in a cheaper country. Edit: Counterintuitively, high int…

> Edit: Counterintuitively, high interest rates can help middle class people that don’t have homes. House prices drop, so you need less deposit.

At least in the USA you can buy a house with very little down nowadays because of lower interest rates.

In the end it’s always better to have lower interest rates as principal is always better than interest. Why make banks richer?

High interest rates favor cash buyers which in many markets are who you are competing with anyways.

Re: What broke Sweden? Real estate bust exposes big divide

#180

Post by [deleted] »

brabel wrote: post #44
nivenkos wrote: post #7

The main problem is the terrible rent control system - with a lucky few getting rent-controlled first-hand contracts, and everyone else facing a cut-throat almost completely unregulated market of sub-letting. Rent control never works.

Very true. I wanted to buy an investment property in Sweden, and rent it out while waiting for prices to go back up in a few years... but learned that this is not a thing here! If you want to rent out, you need permission of your building association, which normally won't give it... or you can buy a "detached house" (no association) which is usually much more expensive, but then you must deal with renters and find th…

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