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Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

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Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#81

Post by tpoacher »

q7xvh97o2pDhNrh wrote: post #53
canadiantim wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the signal is being sent, you can be pretty sure that due to the intrinsic efficiency-maximization that biological systems perform then most likely the mechanism for detecting and acting upon it has been evolved by other organisms, especially for something as fitness-critical as stress.

It's a nice thought. But many humans aren't able to do that with each other, so it seems like a high bar for a potato.

You reminded me one of my favourite quotes:

"There is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the smartest bears and the dumbest tourists"

~ Quote by a forest ranger at Yosemite National Park, on why it is hard to design the perfect garbage bin to keep bears from breaking into it.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#82

Post by camgunz »

ungamedplayer wrote: post #17
camgunz wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So true, this has become one of my mantras.

How do you mentally frame it. Like "ignorance is acceptable" or "we are limited beings" I think as long as we are within the realm of reality, no single person or species can know everything so we need to accept contextual knowledge will be out limitation. I often wonder to what level will we need to know someone to be able to satisfy abstract statements.

Mostly that life is wondrous and infinite, and if you're miserable or angry there's probably something you can learn to help with it, and this probably also works on a species level too.

It can also give perspective. "Argh my coworker reformatted all my multiline list comprehensions" can become "what if reincarnation is real but it works in reverse with humanity somewhere near the bottom and bees somewhere near the top". Etc.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#83

Post by olyjohn »

withinboredom wrote: post #52
steve_adams_86 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t think we’re all that murderous at all unless we’re subjected to acute, severe stresses and/or maladaptive processes (usually early in life). I genuinely care about the well being of other living things and would hate to be in a position where I felt murder was necessary. I know I’m not alone. Seeing how war affects soldiers, I suspect the experience of killing and witnessing death is typically very traumatic…

Without modern agriculture + nutrition, I don’t think you could survive without eating meat (if I’m wrong, feel free to ignore the rest of this). That means you have to murder an animal to live and don’t really get a choice in the matter. This why we are inherently murderous. Sure, these days we pay other people to do it, but when you pick up a burger; that cow was murdered — hopefully humanly.

Hmm. I don't agree that all killing is murder.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#84

Post by costco »

Interestingly L. Ron Hubbard was laughed at for saying tomatoes scream when [sliced](https://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2012/06/16/meet-your-veget...). I don't know enough about this to know how important it is or whether it's actually some kind of signalling.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#86

Post by bmitc »

afarviral wrote: post #12

My very unscientific take is the noises are the result of a mundane mechanical process that is a consequence of the plant not having enough water or loss of water due to cutting, which leads to some cavitation bubbles forming. So it may only be as interesting as saying that your water starts "screaming" when it is being boiled.

You could also describe a human having an appendage chopped off in the same "mundane" mechanical way: loss of fluids, mechanical damage to nerves sending electrical pulses, etc. To some external observer, it's "just" a purely physical process. I'm not sure it's a useful description or perspective.

The point here is that although maybe the mechanism here is just a mechanical process (although, what isn't?), the important thing are the responses to this, by the plant, other plants, and other organisms. Boiling water isn't going to take some action based upon it boiling nor are other organisms.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#88

Post by mcswell »

Euphorbium wrote: post #31
akomtu wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's wild about it? Plants shrink when drying up and that collapses tiny cavities in their stems. It's only surprising that this sound can be detected so easily.

If you camp in spring near fast growing grasses or bushes, you can clearly hear them grow.

Maybe you can hear paint dry, too.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#89

Post by kilianinbox »

The intriguing sound produced by my guitar can be quite revealing, particularly when it’s out of tune. All physical objects have a resonant characteristic that conveys information. When an object, such as a sphere, undergoes a transformation, its resonance changes as well. Additionally, in systems with flowing components, specific flow rates can yield a wide range of patterns. Some might be chaotic, while others, like those arising from DNA replication, result in recognizable and recurring patterns.

To delve deeper into this idea, ponder the question, “Can AI bridge the gap between human consciousness and that of other animals, like whales?” Investigating the inherent intelligence within these patterns can provide us with valuable insights.

As we embark on an era where humanity sets an example for our behavior towards less powerful beings, it’s crucial to acknowledge that artificial general intelligence (AGI) might replicate our actions. The time has come for us to establish a benchmark and pave the way for a more ethical and harmonious world.

Additionally, many have heard of animals that feast on fallen fruit. Embracing a similar approach could prove beneficial for humans before we contemplate altering our DNA to incorporate photosynthesis in the quest for ideal ethics. So, let’s keep an open mind and explore the possibilities! ;)

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#90

Post by mcswell »

I am astounded that no one has mentioned "The Sound Machine" by Roald Dahl (1949), in which a scientist invents a machine that makes ultrasonic sounds audible to humans. He discovers that plants scream when cut. You can read it at https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/1949/09/17/the-sound-mach...
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