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Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

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Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#51

Post by philipov »

svara wrote: post #30

Informative here meaning that you can deduce something about a plant's condition from faint sounds emitted by it. It's not implying that the plants use those sounds for the purpose of transmitting information. From the article: "These results demonstrate the potential in studying plant bioacoustics, suggest that plant acoustic emissions may play an important role in ecology and evolution, and may have direct implicat…

If you break a branch, the sound of it breaking informs you that you have broken a branch.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#52

Post by withinboredom »

steve_adams_86 wrote: post #49
arcanemachiner wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I don’t think we’re all that murderous at all unless we’re subjected to acute, severe stresses and/or maladaptive processes (usually early in life). I genuinely care about the well being of other living things and would hate to be in a position where I felt murder was necessary. I know I’m not alone. Seeing how war affects soldiers, I suspect the experience of killing and witnessing death is typically very traumatic…

Without modern agriculture + nutrition, I don’t think you could survive without eating meat (if I’m wrong, feel free to ignore the rest of this). That means you have to murder an animal to live and don’t really get a choice in the matter. This why we are inherently murderous. Sure, these days we pay other people to do it, but when you pick up a burger; that cow was murdered — hopefully humanly.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#53

Post by q7xvh97o2pDhNrh »

canadiantim wrote: post #47
svara wrote: post #30

Informative here meaning that you can deduce something about a plant's condition from faint sounds emitted by it. It's not implying that the plants use those sounds for the purpose of transmitting information. From the article: "These results demonstrate the potential in studying plant bioacoustics, suggest that plant acoustic emissions may play an important role in ecology and evolution, and may have direct implicat…

If the signal is being sent, you can be pretty sure that due to the intrinsic efficiency-maximization that biological systems perform then most likely the mechanism for detecting and acting upon it has been evolved by other organisms, especially for something as fitness-critical as stress.

It's a nice thought. But many humans aren't able to do that with each other, so it seems like a high bar for a potato.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#55

Post by kjkjadksj »

steve_adams_86 wrote: post #49
arcanemachiner wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I don’t think we’re all that murderous at all unless we’re subjected to acute, severe stresses and/or maladaptive processes (usually early in life). I genuinely care about the well being of other living things and would hate to be in a position where I felt murder was necessary. I know I’m not alone. Seeing how war affects soldiers, I suspect the experience of killing and witnessing death is typically very traumatic…

I think our current culture is biased to feel weird about killing. Historically, killing was often a form of entertainment for the public, and a matter of course for getting the nutrients for life.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#57

Post by debesyla »

steponlego wrote: post #32

Vegans are going to have to re-evaluate their life choices. It might be much more cruel to harvest a field of soybeans than it is to kill a cow.

1) Veganism isn't solely about cruelty;

2) I find your debate that "structure/texture changing plant matter making sounds is the same as animal matter/brain feeling"... interesting.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#58

Post by JumpCrisscross »

q7xvh97o2pDhNrh wrote: post #53
canadiantim wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the signal is being sent, you can be pretty sure that due to the intrinsic efficiency-maximization that biological systems perform then most likely the mechanism for detecting and acting upon it has been evolved by other organisms, especially for something as fitness-critical as stress.

It's a nice thought. But many humans aren't able to do that with each other, so it seems like a high bar for a potato.

> many humans aren't able to do that with each other

Many doesn’t disprove that some do. And it need not be plants; if symbiotic insects pick up on the cue, that’s still interesting.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#59

Post by LegitShady »

canadiantim wrote: post #47
svara wrote: post #30

Informative here meaning that you can deduce something about a plant's condition from faint sounds emitted by it. It's not implying that the plants use those sounds for the purpose of transmitting information. From the article: "These results demonstrate the potential in studying plant bioacoustics, suggest that plant acoustic emissions may play an important role in ecology and evolution, and may have direct implicat…

If the signal is being sent, you can be pretty sure that due to the intrinsic efficiency-maximization that biological systems perform then most likely the mechanism for detecting and acting upon it has been evolved by other organisms, especially for something as fitness-critical as stress.

I'm not sure why you can assume that without any direct evidence.

Re: Sounds emitted by plants under stress are airborne and informative

#60

Post by pfannkuchen »

mdp2021 wrote: post #29
Ekaros wrote: post #18

Does this throw out the whole moral panic about animal welfare? If plants suffer too, isn't it wrong to eat them as well? Or there should be real focus in humane treatment and harvesting them?

> panic None of those concerns are new. Jainism is at least three millennia old.

It is much newer in many parts of the world.
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