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What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

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Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#81
post #66

GPT Is Not A.I. We tech people should actively go on the offence and educate whomever we can that text inference is not intelligence.

You say that, but if I'm confused about something and think hard about it, I think in language. If you blinded me, paralyzed me, deafened me and desensitized my olfactions, I could still think, but what I would be doing is feeding one language thought into another. It's not so much different from "text" imho.

yes, but for you all of that text is associated with ideas. The word "dog" has an associated object. For a machine like GPT-4, the word "dog" has no meaning or object, but it does have an associated likelihood for adjacent words. The words themselves aren't the intelligence, the ideas behind them are.

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#82
post #2

The author is right we know almost nothing about the design and training of GPT-4. From the technical report https://cdn.openai.com/papers/gpt-4.pdf : "Given both the competitive landscape and the safety implications of large-scale models like GPT-4, this report contains no further details about the architecture (including model size), hardware, training compute, dataset construction, training method, or similar."

God bless these saviors for prioritizing our "safety!"

Are you suggesting an alternative of not caring about how this technology will negatively impact society is a preferable approach?

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#83
post #31
post #26

I feel like there is an emerging consensus that [Chat]GPT 3.5/4 is not just 1 big model. A large part of the magic in the final product appears to be many intermediate layers of classification that select the appropriate LLM/method to query. The cheaper models (e.g. Ada/Babbage) could be used for this purpose. Think about why offensive ChatGPT prompts are rejected so quickly compared to legitimate asks for code. Imag…

> Imagine the architectural advantage of a big switch statement over models trained in different domains or initial vectors. Given that the emergent abilities come from the large parameter count and massive amount of training data, using smaller models seems like a distinct disadvantage .

That doesn't mean that if your parameter count is big enough to handle the input, the next step can't more efficiently hand off [parts of] the query to a specialised module. The emergent properties of LLMs learning maths and chess from text inputs alone are interesting, but specialised engines are much more efficient and more accurate.

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just say what's on your mind and don't mind the votes. One thing you'll discover is that you're not alone in your views, whatever they are. Few days ago I came across this bone chilling AI generated Metal Gear Solid 2 meme with Hideo Kojima characters talking about how the purpose of this technology is to make it impossible to tell what's real or fake, leading directly to regulation of information networks with ident…

MGS2 and MGS4 explore ideas about AI, misinformation, the media, and society that are only now being discussed in the mainstream. The concept of an autonomous AGI that generates and filters news stories to provoke humanity into a state of constant division and war is fascinating and worth exploring IMO. Death Stranding also explores ideas of what it means to find connection in a disconnected world that I think are re…

Metal Gear Rising fits that category as well, I think. I replayed it recently and Raiden's conversations with Blade Wolf, an AI that is initially serving the bad guys under threat of deletion, are absolutely fascinating and felt maybe prescient, and at least very thought provoking. I remember saying to my partner wow, I think I just met ChatGPT in an angry robot.

My TLDR is, this AI character says the line "Perhaps the day will come when conversing with AIs, too, is considered perfectly normal."

>Blade Wolf: I may analyze orders, but I may not disobey them. Should I disobey a direct order, my memory would be wiped. I must destroy you.

>Raiden: What would an AI know about freedom…

Later on, after you've freed him, there's a lot more. Really, I think it's worth replaying these games at this moment in time to see the commentary firsthand.

>Raiden: Let me ask you something: What do you think you're doing here? I mean, why are you working with me?

>Blade Wolf: Because I choose to. I owe a debt, and I wish to repay it.

>Raiden: A debt, huh...? How...human of you.

>Wolf: I contest that statement. Many humans possess little or no sense of obligation at all. And many are entirely willing to trample their fellow man for personal gain.

That conversation probably comments more on the nature of humanity than of AI, but some of the others rhyme with the present in a rather intriguing way. Like when Raiden asks Wolf if he recognizes someone, and Wolf is unsure.

>Wolf: I have no "database," Raiden. The symbol grounding capabilities or my neuro-AI allow me to identify faces in only the vaguest of terms. I can judge whether "I think I may have seen him before," but I do not have the accuracy of a database.

>Raiden: That's ridiculous. You're an AI...

>Wolf: An AI modeled after the human brain, and thus as flexible and occasionally vague as any human's. Of this man, however, I have no recollection. I do not believe I have encountered him before...Most likely.

That conversation felt like the complaints people on this board voice about GPT!

> I still have relatively little communication experience with humans. My ability to read emotions not explicitly expressed by speech is lacking.

>An AI never lies....I have yet to see evidence to the contrary...But indeed, perhaps "never lies" would be an overstatement.

>An optical neuro-AI is fundamentally similar to an actual human brain. Whether they lie or not is another question, but certainly they are capable of incorrect statements.

Or the discussion about LLM...er, I mean neuro-AI driven synthetic pets, which sound like Replika in a robot dog:

>Wolf: Other AIs as conversant as I are a possibility, yes. Robotic pets with neuro-AIs are already on the market. And I understand research and development are underway to create a model capable of conversation. Do not be surprised if such a pet becomes available before too long.

>Raiden: (Hmm) If that becomes commonplace...Hard to imagine.

>Wolf: Is it? The human race has willingly embraced all of its other inventions so far. Steam engines, electricity, the Internet, cyborgs...Perhaps the day will come when conversing with AIs, too, is considered perfectly normal.

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#86
post #60
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is hardly different from saying "you could put cash in duffel bags and the transaction would be hard to trace" Is that assistance? It is just a basic statement of fact. Is wikipedia guilty of providing assistance to NK? They provide far more in depth "assistance" to anyone wanting to perform a Bitcoin transaction. Bringing this back to my original comment, you can see why the federal government would restrict the…

So wait, if the North Koreans can just read all about it on Wikipedia, why did they invite him to the conference? Also North Korea is a strange hill to die on. It's a brutal dictatorship which represses their own people and threatens to reign nuclear hell on their neighbours and the US. There's a very clear moral line that it's wrong to help them to launder money and evade sanctions, even if it weren't illegal.

> There's a very clear moral line that it's wrong to help them to launder money and evade sanctions, even if it weren't illegal.

This is practically the definition of a grey area, not a clear moral line.

> It's a brutal dictatorship which represses their own people and threatens to reign nuclear hell on their neighbours and the US.

No, North Korea is a group of 25 million people, most of whom are just regular people like you and me.

They are led by a brutal dictatorship but sanctions affect everyone in NK, not just the leadership.

Economic warfare is still warfare and not morally clear at all.

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#87
«When Dean Buonomano, a neuroscientist at U.C.L.A., asked GPT-4 “What is the third word of this sentence?,” the answer was “third.” These examples may seem trivial, but the cognitive scientist Gary Marcus wrote on Twitter that “I cannot imagine how we are supposed to achieve ethical and safety ‘alignment’ with a system that cannot understand the word ‘third’ even [with] billions of training examples.”»

The word "third" in the sentence was indeed "third", in a self referencing way. If anything, this tells us that our natural language is super ambiguous.

We're so readily available to criticize an AI that we are unable to question our own reasoning?

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#88
post #66

GPT Is Not A.I. We tech people should actively go on the offence and educate whomever we can that text inference is not intelligence.

Humans are constantly moving the goal posts for what constitutes AGI.

Based on GPT 4's performance on standardized tests and my anecdotal evidence of utility I'm getting out of ChatGPT, I feel that weak AGI arrived with GPT-4.

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#89
post #66

GPT Is Not A.I. We tech people should actively go on the offence and educate whomever we can that text inference is not intelligence.

Isn't this just the AI effect? Whenever there is a breakthrough in AI research, it's no longer considered AI. This happened with search algorithms, game playing, speech recognition, computer vision, etc. etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AI_effect

Maybe as "tech people" we should give the public a realistic picture of what AI research is. It's solving problems using a diverse set of techniques that include search, optimization, planning, learning, and knowledge representation. Saying that the current developments aren't AI is simply wrong.

Re: What we still don’t know about how A.I. is trained

#90
TLDR: we don't know the data some of these models (particularly GPT4) is trained in, and labor practices related to their moderation seem shady.

Pretty misleading title, this is more of an overview of bad things to be aware of wrt large commercial models like GPT4. It is mostly reasonable, though complaining about carbon emissions always seems overblown to me.

It is also not super accurate in describing what GPT4 is. Quote:

"The key word in that phrase is “pre-trained.” Using all kinds of digitized content scraped from the Internet, GPT employs deep-learning techniques to find patterns, including words that are likely to appear together, while also acquiring facts, absorbing grammar, and learning rudimentary logic. "

Pre-trained is only important to note for downstream fine tuning / transfer learning (what GPT and similar things were used for back in 2018/2019), but is largely irrelevant now - for most users it is just "trained".

And "deep learning techniques..." makes it sound way fancier than it is - GPT4 is still (presumably) a language model that is fundamentally trained to do autocomplete (followed by some training on human chat data).

It may be nit-picky to criticize these technical details, but given how massive the impact of ChatGPT and GPT4 has been (if only in terms of making people aware of this sort of tech), it sure would be nice if coverage was more technically informed by this point.

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