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Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

theguardian.com

261–270 of 377 posts

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#261

I think a more defensible phrase would be "net negative to society". Crypto has its positive uses, but you have to balance those against the negatives of slow transfer speeds, speculative bubbles, scams, energy consumption, and carbon emissions. Also, it needs to be said that Nvidia is probably just jumping on the next marketing bandwagon by pivoting to LLMs after the collapse of crypto. This doesn't seem like a prin…

>Crypto has its positive uses, but you have to balance those against the negatives of slow transfer speeds, speculative bubbles, scams, energy consumption, and carbon emissions.

Good list on the negatives, but don't forget child trafficking, drugs, and other illegal uses. Like you, I have a hard time seeing a net positive when you add it all up.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#262
post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are people that still have their accounts frozen because they donated to the truckers in Canada. That’s insane. Other countries had or will have similar cases in the future. We absolutely should have a way to exchange money without the governments involvement. The government already has the monopoly on physical force. That ought to be enough. So yes, there is a use case. But you’re correct in that it hasn’t rea…

You’re wrong. All accounts have been unfrozen. They were frozen for less than 2 weeks. Stop spreading misinformative nonsense for you political agenda. This is not the platform for it.

No they weren't all unfrozen.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#263
post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is possible that there is no idea in the history of mankind less punk rock than cryptocurrency.

Cryptocurrencies enable people to do so much more than speculate on price and trade pictures of apes. https://cryptome.org/ap.htm https://bitcoin.org/en/bitcoin-paper https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Silk_Road_(marketplace) https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decentralized_autonomous_org... https://techcrunch.com/2021/10/09/crypto-remittances-are-a-l...

That may be. But that was true of virtually everything punk rock opposed, too (that there were supposed upsides as well as obvious downsides). All I'm saying is that there's nothing punk about it. I happen also to think there's little redeeming about it as well, but I'm not prepared to lay out a case for that right now.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#264

I do not own any crypto myself. The grown-up opinion is of course to view all crypto ""investments"" with extreme skepticism, which is an absolutely sane and correct position. With that said, I like the idea of cryptocurrencies simply because they are punk as f*ck, and I'd like whatever leadership in charge to know that they do not have absolute power to run anyone else's life. Apart from magic internet money, I cann…

> punk as f*ck Those Sand Hill Road VC investments were definitely punk. > the gov't adds through decision taken by ombudsman/committee, the more power asymmetry is added This has nothing to do with whether Bitcoin, or some MLM scheme, or Ponzi's postal reply coupons have value or not. For over a century they've all promoted the scam as power to the little guy. Also if you're tired of fiat money, there are alternativ…

>> punk as f*ck

> Those Sand Hill Road VC investments were definitely punk.

I remember fondly the very early years of bitcoins, when it was worth nothing. I was probably too naïve at the time and didn't see the libertarian agenda of a lot of people, but it really did seem like a lot of the community was made of cryptopunks, excited with this idea of a cryptographic distributed virtual currency. Something that felt like it came straight out of a sci-fi novel. At the time, I think a lot of people (including me) thought that it could maybe help people in authoritarian country, make international transfer cheaper and faster, and digitize banks which felt so behind (I remember having to still call my bank on the phone to be able to do a lot of operations).

This sadly very promptly disappeared. It should have been obvious that a lot of rule surrounding banking where there for a reason. Cryptocurrencies became widely used (and recognized) for its criminal usage, facilitating ransomware, scams, money laundering, financing terrorism and other criminal network. Sure it was fun, and innocent enough, to be able to buy a bag of weed "anonymously" from the dark web, but sadly a lot of usage was darker than that. Authoritarian country, and again it should have been obvious, didn't have much trouble regulating their usage to a point that it couldn't be safely used in a amount that was not insignifiant. But most just didn't care because it didn't actually changed anything for them. And then years and years of development, but no significant progress seemed to be made. Transaction where impossible to scale and became massively expensive and the fundamental flaw of the technology seems to be insurmontable. Ethereum came with a nice promise also, the idea of a global decentralized machine. Program that could be run "on-the-chain" and enforced contract, promising to get rid of the need of a third party. But it also became obvious that it had all the disadvantage of having no third party and none of the advantage.

The crypto community also manage to prove to a massive extent the usefulness of regulation. There was a time where every day there were multiple new cryptocurrency with a nice shiny website, a white paper full of buzzword and not much else, promising a ICO in a few days. Then once the whole pump and dump was done, it vanished from existence. Over and over again. At some point ICO where replaced by NFT. Different name, same result. After the hype (a.k.a the marketing period), you were left with a useless and worthless digital token, and the only way to get rid of it was trying hard to convince other that it was worth anything.

Although I have to say, "fake it until you make it really" seems to be a core value of any crypto-enthusiate. Despite still having no actual usefulness, outside of being a vehicule for financial speculation, so much money was dumped into the whole ecosystem that it still look like a legitimate business. Crypto.com is (was?) a prime sponsor of F1, BtcTurk had advertisement plastered all over the newly built Atatürk Airport, NFT were "brought" by very famous people, ... And in many way it was successful enough to keep attracting investment, from very serious business-suit wearing people. Will they learn from FTX ? Why would they ? They didn't learn from Mt. Gox, Theter, Ripple, the many fraudulent ICO, the obvious pump and dump. If anything, everyone turns a blind eye because at this point, you either avoid crypto like the plague, you are part of the scam, or you are the one getting scammed.

I really miss those days where it seems like a sci-fi tech. In many ways, I still want to believe, but cryptocurrencies where born on a flawed premise. They are dead, they were always dead and they will remained dead.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#265
post #260
post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crypto aside, it's difficult to point to a less deserving cause than the trucker convoy that paralyzed Ottawa for no good reason (the reasons are no good outside of delusionland).

Women's right to choose what goes in their bodies is an important right in Canada. Not to worry the wartime act will be used on something you personally care about but by that time your rights will be gone.

^ Exhibit A: commenter fails to recognize that there are sometimes good reason to temporarily limit rights, such as to limit the spread of infectious diseases, because commenter knows very little about public health or epidemiology. Commenter believes that anytime rights are limited, it's for a nefarious purpose, and it can't possibly be for a good reason.

How's the syphillis and HIV treating you? Oh what's that? You live in a society that actively limits the spread of these diseases by carefully limiting rights, so you're free to live your life without these diseases? Nice concept.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wasn't even aware that the accounts were frozen. That is horrifying.

What’s horrifying is living in a city where someone has attached a train horn to their truck, and honks it hourly through the night for several weeks. What’s horrifying is leaving your apartment building in downtown Ottawa and being spit on and verbally harassed for wearing a mask. What’s horrifying is smelling the literal human shit in the streets waft up through your apartment building’s ventilation system and into…

"What’s horrifying is smelling the literal human shit in the streets waft up through your apartment building’s ventilation system and into your unit"

That smell comes from parliament.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#267

Amid a torrent of AI-generated content, cryptographic signatures in cameras strike me as a useful application of blockchain technology. There will always be a market for authenticity because photojournalism has strategic value.

> cryptographic signatures in cameras strike me as a useful application of blockchain technology

As always with "blockchain", you have to ask the question, "couldn't this be done with non-blockchain technologies, at a fraction of the energy cost?"

There are as far as I can see two things which could be authenticated: "was this photo taken by a physical camera", and "was this photo taken at a particular moment in time". For the first, the camera could sign the RAW file, and append a certificate signed by the camera's manufacturer; AFAIK, cameras which do that already exist. For the second, cryptographic timestamp services are older than blockchain (RFC 3161, see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_timestamping for alternatives), and IIRC were used in Windows to timestamp signed binaries, so that they would keep working even after the key used to sign them expired (as long as the signature was timestamped prior to that expiration).

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#268
post #200
post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uniswap labs owns the GitHub repo, domain name, and discord servers. If their domain, discord, etc disappears, the project would struggle because their smart contracts are difficult to use without the web apps and it would damage the trust in the project. Uniswap owners can shut down their website. They can introduce a 100% fee. They can deactivate their contracts. Yes, people can still use their smart contracts in 5…

So what you're saying is that we need a front-end layer with content-addressable hashes? Like Beaker Browser with Dat, or like IPFS gateways? And then we have a truly decentralized ecosystem in which billions of dollars are invested and trading. And no one owns it! They can't introduce a 100% fee or deactivate their contracts. I read the code. It is impossible.

Yes. I said in my first comment that you can use other tools to access smart contracts.

My point is, all of these tools have central leadership and centralized auxiliary services (DNS, discord, etc). Without the centralized leadership or centralized services, these protocols can’t function.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of those factors establish a fundamental market price for the dollar - you're simply listing the price of admission for any state-backed currency. The dollar has declined in value by over 90% since 1933. By your metrics that must mean that the US is in catastrophic meltdown, but of course it isn't.

> None of those factors establish a fundamental market price for the dollar Neither does the P/E ratio of a company, yet it's still a fundamental used to value stocks. > The dollar has declined in value by over 90% since 1933. Relative to which other currencies?

> Neither does the P/E ratio of a company, yet it's still a fundamental used to value stocks.

Earnings is used to create a valuation of a stock. Price-to-earnings is the result.

As a company's earnings increase, the stock's value increases. As a country's earnings increase, there is no similar correlation with its currency.

> Relative to which other currencies?

Relative to a standard basket of goods.

Re: Cryptocurrencies add nothing useful to society, says chip-maker Nvidia

#270
post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, crypto's main use is crime. Its supporters have various arguments for why crime is actually good.

> Yes, crypto's main use is crime. It is quite a very poor use with such "crime" happening all on a public and transparent blockchain, making it very easy to trace all of that (even if they use a tumbler / mixer) with the funds certainly seized and frozen as soon as it hits the exchange. In fact criminals and scammers still use banks and Zelle to facilitate their criminal enterprise - [0] [1] in the trillions of doll…

And Square.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/jack-dorsey-block-loses-20-16...

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