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Understanding ChatGPT

atmosera.com

61–70 of 241 posts

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#61
post #28

“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? The most common “proofs” I’ve seen: “Humans are more complex”. Ok, so you’re implying we add more complexity (maybe more modalities?); if more complexity is added, will you continue to say “LLMs are just word predictors”? “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you…

This feels like a shifting of the burden of proof. When folks state (oversimplifying by doing so I agree) LLMs and similar tech are "fancy word predictors with parlor tricks" they're usually doing so in response to those that are enchanted into attributing some form of technical magic to it.

Are you implying that, by being similar to humans, that makes it a sentient, living thing? Ducktyping? Just because something walks and talks like a sentient being does not mean that it is.

I'm sure a person from the bronze age would consider my Roomba "alive" and while we can get all philosophical about what alive means, my Roomba is not a living being. I would not confuse the bronze age person by saying "what does it mean to be alive?" And instead I would say, no it is a mechanism made by mankind.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#62
post #28

“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? The most common “proofs” I’ve seen: “Humans are more complex”. Ok, so you’re implying we add more complexity (maybe more modalities?); if more complexity is added, will you continue to say “LLMs are just word predictors”? “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you…

> “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you measure such a thing? I would posit that reasoning is the ability to construct new, previously-unexpressed information from prior information. If ChatGPT existed 110 years ago and fed all the then-known relevant experimental data regarding subatomic particles, it would not have been able to arrive at the new notion of quantum mechanics. If it exist…

Very few humans ever had the ability to derive Quantum Mechanics.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#63
post #28

“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? The most common “proofs” I’ve seen: “Humans are more complex”. Ok, so you’re implying we add more complexity (maybe more modalities?); if more complexity is added, will you continue to say “LLMs are just word predictors”? “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you…

>“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different?

One difference between humans and LLMs is that humans have a wide range of inputs and outputs beyond language. The claim that humans are word predictors is not something I would want to dispute.

The claim that humans are nothing more than word predictors is obviously wrong though. When I go to buy food, it's not because I'm predicting the words "I'm hungry". It's because I'm predicting that I'll be hungry.

For me, the most interesting question is whether the way in which language is related to our perception of the physical and social world as well as our perception of ourselves in this world is a precondition for fully understanding the meaning of language.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#64
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

and soon "Humans are moody and emotional" but Sydney tried to marry and threatened a couple of guys here. If you had attached legs and arms to it, it could be a very interesting companion.

Do we think Sydney tried to marry people due to feeling the same emotional desires and obligations as humans, or because marriage proposals were in its data corpus and it inferred that they were a likely continuation given previous inputs?

In a way, is this how a conscious being would likely continue the conversation ?

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#65
post #28

“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? The most common “proofs” I’ve seen: “Humans are more complex”. Ok, so you’re implying we add more complexity (maybe more modalities?); if more complexity is added, will you continue to say “LLMs are just word predictors”? “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you…

> “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you measure such a thing? I would posit that reasoning is the ability to construct new, previously-unexpressed information from prior information. If ChatGPT existed 110 years ago and fed all the then-known relevant experimental data regarding subatomic particles, it would not have been able to arrive at the new notion of quantum mechanics. If it exist…

Asking: "Describe to me a completely new and credible explanation on why space-time is shrinking"

It gives me: Title: Isotropic Space-Time Contraction: A Novel Hypothesis for Shrinking Space-Time

Abstract: This paper introduces a new and credible explanation for the phenomenon of shrinking space-time, which we call "Isotropic Space-Time Contraction" (ISTC). ISTC postulates that space-time contracts uniformly in all directions due to the continuous creation of dark energy in the quantum vacuum. This process results from the interaction between dark energy and the cosmic fabric, leading to a constant reduction in the scale of space-time.

I think it can create very very very interesting ideas or concepts.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#66

This articles describes much of what many youtubers explained in their videos in the recent few weeks. While I understand the core concept of 'just' picking the next word based on statistics, it doesn't really explain how chatGPT can pull off the stuff it does. E.g. when one asks it to return a poem where each word starts with one letter/next alphabet letter/the ending of the last word, it obviously doesn't 'just' pi…

> While I understand the core concept of 'just' picking the next word based on statistics

That's just the mechanism it uses to generate output - which it not the same as being the way it internally chooses what to say.

I think it's unfortunate that the name LLM (large language model) has stuck for these predictive models, since IMO it's very misleading. The name has stuck since this line of research was born out of much simpler systems that were just language models, and sadly the name has stuck. The "predict next word" concept is also misleading, especially when connected to the false notion that these are just language models. What is true is that:

1) These models are trained by being given feedback on their "predict next word" performance

2) These models generate output a word at a time, and those words are a selection from variety of predictions about how their input might be continued in light of the material they saw during training, and what they have learnt from it

What is NOT true is that these models are operating just at the level of language and are generating output purely based on language level statistics. As Ilya Sutskever (one of the OpenAI founders) has said, these models have used their training data and predict-next-word feedback (a horrible way to have to learn!!!) to build an internal "world model" of the processes generating the data they are operating on. "world model" is jargon, but what it essentially means is that these models have gained some level of understanding of how the world (seen through the lens of language) operates.

So, what really appears to be happening (although I don't think anyone knows in any level of detail), when these models are fed a prompt and tasked with providing a continuation (i.e. a "reply" in context of ChatGPT), is that the input is consumed and per the internal "world model" a high level internal representation of the input is built - starting at the level of language presumably, but including a model of the entities being discussed, relations between them, related knowledge that is recalled, etc, etc, and this internal model of what is being discussed persists (and is updated) throughout the conversation and as it is generating output... The output is generated word by word, but not as a statistical continuation of the prompt, but rather as a statistically likely continuation of texts it saw during training when it had similar internal states (i.e. a similar model of what was being discussed).

You may have heard of "think step by step" or "chain of thought" prompting which are ways to enable these models to perform better on complex tasks where the distance from problem statement (question) to solution (answer) is too great for the model to do in a "single step". What is going on here is that these models, unlike us, are not (yet) designed to iteratively work on a problem and explore it, and instead are limited to a fixed number of processing steps (corresponding to number of internal levels - repeated transformer blocks - between input and output). For simple problems where a good response can conceived/generated within that limited number of steps, the models work well, otherwise you can tell the them to "think step by step" which allows it to overcome this limitation by taking multiple baby steps, and evolving it's internal model of the dialogue.

Most of what I see written about ChatGPT, or these predictive models in general, seems to be garbage. Everyone has an opinion and wants to express it regardless of whether they have any knowledge, or even experience, with the models themselves. I was a bit shocked to see an interview with Karl Friston (a highly intelligent theoretical neuroscientist) the other day, happily pontificating about ChatGPT and offering opinions about it while admitting that he had never even used it!

The unfortunate "language model" name and associated understanding of what "predict next word" would be doing IF (false) they didn't have the capacity to learn anything more than language seems largely to blame.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#67
post #28

“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? The most common “proofs” I’ve seen: “Humans are more complex”. Ok, so you’re implying we add more complexity (maybe more modalities?); if more complexity is added, will you continue to say “LLMs are just word predictors”? “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you…

>“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? One difference between humans and LLMs is that humans have a wide range of inputs and outputs beyond language. The claim that humans are word predictors is not something I would want to dispute. The claim that humans are nothing more than word predictors is obviously wrong though. When I…

Then this implies that you’d maybe think differently if LLMs could have different inputs, correct?

Which they are currently doing. GPT-4 can take visual input.

I totally agree that humans are far more complex than that, but just extend your timeline further and you’ll start to see how the gap in complexity / input variety will narrow.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#68
post #28

“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? The most common “proofs” I’ve seen: “Humans are more complex”. Ok, so you’re implying we add more complexity (maybe more modalities?); if more complexity is added, will you continue to say “LLMs are just word predictors”? “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you…

>“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? One difference between humans and LLMs is that humans have a wide range of inputs and outputs beyond language. The claim that humans are word predictors is not something I would want to dispute. The claim that humans are nothing more than word predictors is obviously wrong though. When I…

that is what modalities mean.

these are being added on.

in particular, we can add many more than humans are able to handle.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#69
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you measure such a thing? I would posit that reasoning is the ability to construct new, previously-unexpressed information from prior information. If ChatGPT existed 110 years ago and fed all the then-known relevant experimental data regarding subatomic particles, it would not have been able to arrive at the new notion of quantum mechanics. If it exist…

Asking: "Describe to me a completely new and credible explanation on why space-time is shrinking" It gives me: Title: Isotropic Space-Time Contraction: A Novel Hypothesis for Shrinking Space-Time Abstract: This paper introduces a new and credible explanation for the phenomenon of shrinking space-time, which we call "Isotropic Space-Time Contraction" (ISTC). ISTC postulates that space-time contracts uniformly in all d…

a quick google reveals that all of the words in the "new" title already exist from human producers, and this is mix and matched together.

Re: Understanding ChatGPT

#70
post #28

“It’s a glorified word predictor” is becoming increasingly maddening to read. Do tell— how can you prove humans are any different? The most common “proofs” I’ve seen: “Humans are more complex”. Ok, so you’re implying we add more complexity (maybe more modalities?); if more complexity is added, will you continue to say “LLMs are just word predictors”? “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you…

> “Humans are actually reasoning. LLMs are not.” Again, how would you measure such a thing? I would posit that reasoning is the ability to construct new, previously-unexpressed information from prior information. If ChatGPT existed 110 years ago and fed all the then-known relevant experimental data regarding subatomic particles, it would not have been able to arrive at the new notion of quantum mechanics. If it exist…

I think there’s a huge misunderstanding of what “original ideas” are and what constitutes novelty.

Mark Twain quote on originality:

“ There is no such thing as a new idea. It is impossible. We simply take a lot of old ideas and put them into a sort of mental kaleidoscope. We give them a turn and they make new and curious combinations. We keep on turning and making new combinations indefinitely; but they are the same old pieces of colored glass that have been in use through all the ages.”

I am not sure how humans “come up with new ideas” themselves. It does seem to be that creativity is simply combining information in new ways.

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