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Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

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Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#71

Post by Vaslo »

haswell wrote: post #62
MagicMoonlight wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how would you feel if there was a database of tech employees? Tech companies have absolute power over people’s lives and a huge amount of private information used for malicious purposes. Would you be happy if it said “Here are tim and james, here is where they live, make them accountable!”?

> Tech companies have absolute power over people’s lives The kind of power wielded by tech companies is not the same kind of power wielded by the police. Comparing them directly in this way runs into some major false equivalence problems. I still see major potential for abuse of such a database and I’m not claiming it is without issue. But logging an interaction with an armed public servant who has the power to detai…

I find the fact that I cannot post certain ideas to Reddit in my local city subreddit without getting downvoted to Oblivion and then no longer can post at all due to negative karma problematic. In fact, I find this way more problematic for me than s handful of asshole cops. Should I start posting information about community managers or employees at Reddit who don’t help in this situation?

Doesn’t matter what your equivalency argument is. This is problematic and opens the door to abuse.

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#72

Post by [deleted] »

MagicMoonlight wrote: post #60
cs02rm0 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know (I'm just a Brit watching from afar), but I'd assume the LAPD have databases full of information on citizens, of course not shared with the public web, only shared with police forces, mostly. The public web though is how citizens share information with each other, I'm not sure excluding police officers would make it better. Seeking an equivalence here also strikes me as a false equivalence - the power ba…

So how would you feel if there was a database of tech employees? Tech companies have absolute power over people’s lives and a huge amount of private information used for malicious purposes. Would you be happy if it said “Here are tim and james, here is where they live, make them accountable!”?

[deleted]

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#73

Post by [deleted] »

mellosouls wrote: post #17

Unless there is an equivalent LAPD initiative that uploads the pictures of law-abiding citizens with names and other identifying info to the public web, there will be suspicions that this is an anti-police (rather than anti-police-surveillance-abuse) measure intended to intimidate and obstruct police work. Neither is it clear how representative the organizers are of those law-abiding citizens generally rather than a…

[deleted]

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#74

Post by PennRobotics »

mellosouls wrote: post #17

Unless there is an equivalent LAPD initiative that uploads the pictures of law-abiding citizens with names and other identifying info to the public web, there will be suspicions that this is an anti-police (rather than anti-police-surveillance-abuse) measure intended to intimidate and obstruct police work. Neither is it clear how representative the organizers are of those law-abiding citizens generally rather than a…

There's a power dynamic. Why should we have public sites like Rate My Professors but professors can't have a public Rate My Students?

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#75

Post by bigbillheck »

Vaslo wrote: post #71
haswell wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tech companies have absolute power over people’s lives The kind of power wielded by tech companies is not the same kind of power wielded by the police. Comparing them directly in this way runs into some major false equivalence problems. I still see major potential for abuse of such a database and I’m not claiming it is without issue. But logging an interaction with an armed public servant who has the power to detai…

I find the fact that I cannot post certain ideas to Reddit in my local city subreddit without getting downvoted to Oblivion and then no longer can post at all due to negative karma problematic. In fact, I find this way more problematic for me than s handful of asshole cops. Should I start posting information about community managers or employees at Reddit who don’t help in this situation? Doesn’t matter what your equ…

What kind of ideas?

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#76

Post by tstrimple »

soared wrote: post #22
ryandrake wrote: post #18

I’m not sure I understand the point of Copwatching and documenting police abuses. Everyone knows about police abuses—the police even document their own abuses themselves with bodycams. It doesn’t matter to them because there are never consequences. It’s pointless to do all this documenting without a way to turn it into accountability.

Tell that to Rodney king

That had immediate feedback, but hasn't seemed to result in any systemic changes. Macklemore references this in his song A Wake.

I grew up during Reaganomics

When Ice T was out there on his killing cops shit

Or Rodney King was getting beat on

And they let off every single officer

And Los Angeles went and lost it

Now every month there's a new Rodney on YouTube

It's just something our generation is used to

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#77

Post by bigbillheck »

MagicMoonlight wrote: post #60
cs02rm0 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know (I'm just a Brit watching from afar), but I'd assume the LAPD have databases full of information on citizens, of course not shared with the public web, only shared with police forces, mostly. The public web though is how citizens share information with each other, I'm not sure excluding police officers would make it better. Seeking an equivalence here also strikes me as a false equivalence - the power ba…

So how would you feel if there was a database of tech employees? Tech companies have absolute power over people’s lives and a huge amount of private information used for malicious purposes. Would you be happy if it said “Here are tim and james, here is where they live, make them accountable!”?

I don't generally have to worry about a DBA shooting my dog.

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#78

Post by hobs »

Vaslo wrote: post #71
haswell wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tech companies have absolute power over people’s lives The kind of power wielded by tech companies is not the same kind of power wielded by the police. Comparing them directly in this way runs into some major false equivalence problems. I still see major potential for abuse of such a database and I’m not claiming it is without issue. But logging an interaction with an armed public servant who has the power to detai…

I find the fact that I cannot post certain ideas to Reddit in my local city subreddit without getting downvoted to Oblivion and then no longer can post at all due to negative karma problematic. In fact, I find this way more problematic for me than s handful of asshole cops. Should I start posting information about community managers or employees at Reddit who don’t help in this situation? Doesn’t matter what your equ…

Sign up a new account I guess?

If the cops decide to beat your ass or follow you in reality your life is meaningfully changed, crying about post karma on reddit is so far divorced from the reality of the situation of cops killing people, stealing, and getting away with it.

My partner is an attorney and she just sued the cops for improperly looking up a specific woman tens of thousands of times, checking in on her, harassing her, following her, stalking her with his cop authority.

Now imagine the opposite, you are on reddit and someone wont stop replying to your comments, which one of these might need some accountability?

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#79

Post by SauciestGNU »

zoklet-enjoyer wrote: post #11
twelvechairs wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or the next AI fad 'LAPD officer generator'

AR glasses with cop recognition

I've been at enough protests where cop agent provocateurs are a problem that this would be an amazing threat identification tool.

Re: Watch the Watchers: LAPD officer database

#80

Post by haswell »

Vaslo wrote: post #71
haswell wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Tech companies have absolute power over people’s lives The kind of power wielded by tech companies is not the same kind of power wielded by the police. Comparing them directly in this way runs into some major false equivalence problems. I still see major potential for abuse of such a database and I’m not claiming it is without issue. But logging an interaction with an armed public servant who has the power to detai…

I find the fact that I cannot post certain ideas to Reddit in my local city subreddit without getting downvoted to Oblivion and then no longer can post at all due to negative karma problematic. In fact, I find this way more problematic for me than s handful of asshole cops. Should I start posting information about community managers or employees at Reddit who don’t help in this situation? Doesn’t matter what your equ…

> I find the fact that I cannot post certain ideas to Reddit in my local city subreddit without getting downvoted to Oblivion and then no longer can post at all due to negative karma problematic

In this scenario, who holds the power to downvote you to oblivion? Who makes the rules about participation relative to karma?

If you said the same things in a local bar, would you find it problematic if people disagreed with you or maybe decided not to talk to you?

To find the behavior of privately moderated community groups more problematic than the behavior of bad cops - behavior that ruins or ends thousands of lives every year - seems like a major misalignment.

> Doesn’t matter what your equivalency argument is. This is problematic and opens the door to abuse.

In a discussion comparing things, equivalency always matters. The world is filled with systems, communities, and organizations that are wide open to abuse. That potential is not by itself an equalizing factor.

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