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Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

finance.yahoo.com

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Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#31

Post by throw239849234 »

KingOfCoders wrote: post #23
Bilal_io wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Dorsey is a big Bitcoin fan, so that’s the kind of utility he appreciates. This sounds disingenuous. Not every fan of Bitcoin supports fraud, drug trafficking.. etc. The dollar is used for such bad activities, should we label everyone that loves the dollar as a supporter of fraud and drugs?

I would be interested in the percentage of 1. Bitcoin (crypto) users who (only) have BC because they hate fiat money 2. Users who have BC because they need it for illegal gains 3. Opportunistic investors 4. Web3ers I have the unsubstantiated feeling that 1 is overstated.

5. People for whom fiat money is impractical for one or more reasons

This category is way larger than people in well-banked Western circles realise. Bitcoin (crypto) is one of the easiest ways for people affected by capital controls or sanctions (on the financial institutions they use, or the country they were unlucky enough to be born in) to freely move their (legally earned, and taxed) money across borders.

Since one of the countries with strict capital controls is China, and one of the countries affected by sanctions is Russia, the scale of this usage of crypto is huge.

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#32

Post by nikanj »

jahnu wrote: post #27
mschuster91 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a German, I used to think the same back when Wirecard was first attacked - and look where that ended. Right now, the financial system is extremely unstable - bad actors with an awful lot of exposure have been exposed, and a lot of people are like sharks in the water, smelling blood. It looks like we're due for another come-to-Jesus moment in the banking scene, they haven't learned enough from 2008.

> they haven't learned enough from 2008. I think it looks like they learned a lot! I.e. make sure you get too big to fail.

Credit Suisse was too big to fail just a month ago

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#33

Post by ano88888 »

KingOfCoders wrote: post #23
Bilal_io wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Dorsey is a big Bitcoin fan, so that’s the kind of utility he appreciates. This sounds disingenuous. Not every fan of Bitcoin supports fraud, drug trafficking.. etc. The dollar is used for such bad activities, should we label everyone that loves the dollar as a supporter of fraud and drugs?

I would be interested in the percentage of 1. Bitcoin (crypto) users who (only) have BC because they hate fiat money 2. Users who have BC because they need it for illegal gains 3. Opportunistic investors 4. Web3ers I have the unsubstantiated feeling that 1 is overstated.

internationally, 2 using cypto for illegal or unofficial means to transfer money is definitely more than 90%. The rest can share the remaining 10%.

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#34

Post by posharma »

I know this is going to be controversial, but I think it has to be said. Jack ruined Twitter first [1] (by over-hiring and then selling it to Elon) and now it's Block's turn. He still made billions, while thousands got laid off and are still suffering under Elon's questionable so called leadership. Are these the entrepreneurs we should be looking up to? The tech industry is already facing the brunt because of the mistakes CEOs have done by "miscalculating" or "misjudging" the macroeconomic conditions; the same CEOs are enjoying their billions.

[1] https://twitter.com/jack/status/1588913276980633600

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#35

Post by qeternity »

Bilal_io wrote: post #21
pavlov wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dorsey is a big Bitcoin fan, so that’s the kind of utility he appreciates. Coming soon: the CashApp ransomware API.

> Dorsey is a big Bitcoin fan, so that’s the kind of utility he appreciates. This sounds disingenuous. Not every fan of Bitcoin supports fraud, drug trafficking.. etc. The dollar is used for such bad activities, should we label everyone that loves the dollar as a supporter of fraud and drugs?

I find these takes to be so disingenuous. The dollar is used in this manner in spite of legal and regulatory efforts. Bitcoin is used in this manner bc it was designed explicitly to be immune to these efforts.

I respect people who believe money should be uncensorable. But at least own that view and the implications, instead of all of this fiat whataboutism.

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#36

Post by jsemrau »

benjaminwootton wrote: post #10

“ Initial Disclosure: After extensive research, we have taken a short position in shares of Block, Inc. (NYSE: SQ). This report represents our opinion, and we encourage every reader to do their own due diligence. Please see our full disclaimer at the bottom of the report.” I’m surprised that it’s legal to short sell then go on the attack. If it is, imagine having the cojones to do that and then go live with this repo…

If you'd spent 2 years researching a topic you'd likely think otherwise.

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#37

Post by Closi »

achow wrote: post #26
Closi wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Worth noting that the title of this HN post is a little misleading - and Hindenburg actually have not accused Block of fraud (only of facilitating others to commit fraud through their platform).

Hidenburgh seems to have directly accused Block. Block has systematically taken advantage of the demographics it claims to be helping. The “magic” behind Block’s business has not been disruptive innovation, but rather the company’s willingness to facilitate fraud against consumers and the government, avoid regulation, dress up predatory loans and fees as revolutionary technology, and mislead investors with inflated m…

Facilitating fraud != committing fraud

Most banks and payment platforms will facilitate fraud to some extent, but it’s their duty to reduce this with compliance procedures.

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#38

Post by apetrovic »

throw239849234 wrote: post #31
KingOfCoders wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be interested in the percentage of 1. Bitcoin (crypto) users who (only) have BC because they hate fiat money 2. Users who have BC because they need it for illegal gains 3. Opportunistic investors 4. Web3ers I have the unsubstantiated feeling that 1 is overstated.

5. People for whom fiat money is impractical for one or more reasons This category is way larger than people in well-banked Western circles realise. Bitcoin (crypto) is one of the easiest ways for people affected by capital controls or sanctions (on the financial institutions they use, or the country they were unlucky enough to be born in) to freely move their (legally earned, and taxed) money across borders. Since o…

[citation needed]

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#39

Post by malermeister »

qeternity wrote: post #35
Bilal_io wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Dorsey is a big Bitcoin fan, so that’s the kind of utility he appreciates. This sounds disingenuous. Not every fan of Bitcoin supports fraud, drug trafficking.. etc. The dollar is used for such bad activities, should we label everyone that loves the dollar as a supporter of fraud and drugs?

I find these takes to be so disingenuous. The dollar is used in this manner in spite of legal and regulatory efforts. Bitcoin is used in this manner bc it was designed explicitly to be immune to these efforts. I respect people who believe money should be uncensorable. But at least own that view and the implications, instead of all of this fiat whataboutism.

> I respect people who believe money should be uncensorable.

Why? That is just another way of saying moneyed interests should be above the rule of law. What could possibly be respectable about a view this odious?

Re: Block loses 20% of value as Hindenburg Research alleges fraud

#40

Post by cinntaile »

KingOfCoders wrote: post #23
Bilal_io wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Dorsey is a big Bitcoin fan, so that’s the kind of utility he appreciates. This sounds disingenuous. Not every fan of Bitcoin supports fraud, drug trafficking.. etc. The dollar is used for such bad activities, should we label everyone that loves the dollar as a supporter of fraud and drugs?

I would be interested in the percentage of 1. Bitcoin (crypto) users who (only) have BC because they hate fiat money 2. Users who have BC because they need it for illegal gains 3. Opportunistic investors 4. Web3ers I have the unsubstantiated feeling that 1 is overstated.

This is a false dichotomy with 4 choices instead.
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