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Ritalin Gone Wrong

nytimes.com

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Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#41

Post by tocomment »

dlytle wrote: post #5
tokenadult wrote: post #4

I was interested to see that the researcher who wrote the op-ed, a psychologist based at my alma mater, has participated in some of the research projects he reviews in the op-ed. As I read the comments here, I'll be collecting ideas for questions to ask the local researcher in person as I try to learn more about ADD. I was particularly interested to see that the op-ed criticized several earlier studies for their stud…

I'm currently taking adult ADD meds (Adderall); it's a double edged sword, and I'd personally really prefer to find another method. The primary problem is, during any sort of transition I would be pretty useless, and I can't afford to take that long being useless with my current job. I went cold turkey from 25mg of Adderall XR daily, and for about a week and a half I was absolutely dead. I'd have a splitting headache…

What do you mean by transition?

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#42

Post by tokenadult »

sek wrote: post #20

So Ritalin is just a usual mind boosting drug, it has rebound effects and people develop a tolerance. Like cocaine, MDMA, ephedrine and meth. It differs in it's euphoric and adverse effects, but the positive influence is not permanent. Not a single drug can help you in the long term, you have to develop the abilities yourself. These drugs have the opposite effect, because as long as you take them you don't evolve. Th…

because as long as you take them you don't evolve.

Homeostasis of the human body does make any intervention hard to keep long-lasting. I take it you mean "develop" (the word you used in the preceding sentence) for where you wrote "evolve," because of course individuals don't evolve (in the biological sense of the word) but rather populations do by changes in gene frequencies. The story of obesity seems to be that change is hard for human beings, period, whether the intervention is medical or a lifestyle intervention. If a person has a personal tendency that is truly a disorder for adaptation in current society, maybe nothing should be taken off the table for the person seeking help. But, yes, I agree with you that willpower-developed kinds of personal behavior changes are surely helpful for ADD and for other problems too, perhaps more possible if they are backed up by external helps of one kind or another.

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#43

Post by oflannabhra »

mynegation wrote: post #16

While I am not prepared to discuss specifics of Ritalin's effects, the article raises very important point: a lot of problems happening with children are due to the neglect on their parents' (or primary caregivers') side. I've always wondered how you have to be licensed to drive any more or less complicated mechanism, but yet you can become responsible for things thousand times more complicated and important, like ch…

I agree that children are incredibly complicated, and raising them properly requires knowledge, but I fail to see how the educational system and government regulation have any responsibility or authority in this domain.

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#44

Post by rkon »

nerfhammer wrote: post #36
rkon wrote: post #27

Parents should really take note of the studies and conclusions in this article. As someone diagnosed with ADHD who has tried numerous medications (Adderall regular and XR, Vyvanse, Strattera, Focalin, and Wellbutrin) I have to say I would never ever EVER allow a young child of mine to take any of them. I can't even fathom how confusing and damaging the side effects of these medications could be to the fragile psyche…

You may have been more sensitive to the side effects than most.

I didn't personally experience all of those side effects, they just seem to be the most common based on dozens of other users of those medications I spoke with after beginning them myself. There are some other very common side effects I didn't mention as well, such as headaches/bouts of anger/crashing when the medication is wearing off each day, dehydration/drymouth, and heart palpitations or racing heartbeat.

The side effect that most annoyed me was actually loss of appetite, which is basically accepted as 'normal' when taking stimulants. Anxiety was probably a bigger issue with Adderall, though. I don't recall ever talking to someone who felt zero side effects from any these medications.

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#45

Post by mikeash »

psaccounts wrote: post #30

It is a shame that most people are unaware of the efficacy of Homeopathy to treat ADD, ADHD and autism-spectrum disorders. Do some research and you'll see how hundreds of thousands of people have been cured of these ailments using Homeopathy alone.

The placebo effect can be a wonderful thing.

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#46

Post by mikeash »

itmag wrote: post #3

I'd be interested in hearing what a (non-kooky) fringe scientist like Seth Roberts has to say on ADD. It always seemed weird to me that huge amounts of people should be taking Speed on a daily basis. Has there been any research into treating ADD with stuff like low-carb diets, vitamin D, limiting EMF exposure, limiting videogames, fish oil, filtering chemicals out of drinking water? I'm just throwing those out there…

I find the juxtaposition of "non-kooky" and "limiting EMF exposure"/"filtering chemicals" to be really odd. A lot of these may well be interesting, but those two in particular just scream pure kook at me.

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#47

Post by nerfhammer »

hop wrote: post #19

I have a real problem labeling 10 year olds that get bored and fidgety in boring situations with having a brain disorder and giving them speed. Find me 10 successful entreprenuers and I bet I can show you 10 people who had a tough time sitting through unengaging lesson plans in school. Doesn't help with ballooning class sizes either.

This armchair criticism might apply to the hyperactivity subtype but perhaps not as well to the inattention subtype.

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#48

Post by thaumaturgy »

tokenadult wrote: post #4

I was interested to see that the researcher who wrote the op-ed, a psychologist based at my alma mater, has participated in some of the research projects he reviews in the op-ed. As I read the comments here, I'll be collecting ideas for questions to ask the local researcher in person as I try to learn more about ADD. I was particularly interested to see that the op-ed criticized several earlier studies for their stud…

I have been off-and-on seriously tempted to find Adderall, but when I stop and think about why I want it, it's because my workload is severe and I don't feel like I'm being productive enough. Then I try to question whether or not I've got unreasonable expectations for how long I can sit in front of a computer and focus on a single task.

Over the last couple of years my diet has improved a lot: less meat, less sugar, almost no junk food, more nuts and fruits and vegetables, and at least a liter of water per day now. Before, it was a rare day that I drank even a glass of water -- I usually preferred chocolate milk or heavily sugared iced tea or something.

I also get a lot more exercise now and try to maintain a more regular sleep schedule.

At 33, I'm in the best shape of my life, and I've found that now when I do need to sit down and do work, I can do it for longer and with less frustration. When I get sick of sitting and focusing on a stupid little screen a couple of feet from my nose, I know it's time to get up and do something else.

So as I gradually develop more discipline in the rest of my life, I wonder if maybe that's all I really needed to begin with. People aren't that far removed from their hunter-gatherer days, and now we sit all day surrounded by walls, without sunshine, eating really poor diets -- maybe an inability to focus and concentrate all day is just our bodys' way of objecting to that rapid change.

"Eat better, get exercise, reduce distractions" isn't a very sexy answer though, when compared to, "take a pill and become awesome like that guy in Limitless."

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#49

Post by nerfhammer »

rkon wrote: post #44
nerfhammer wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You may have been more sensitive to the side effects than most.

I didn't personally experience all of those side effects, they just seem to be the most common based on dozens of other users of those medications I spoke with after beginning them myself. There are some other very common side effects I didn't mention as well, such as headaches/bouts of anger/crashing when the medication is wearing off each day, dehydration/drymouth, and heart palpitations or racing heartbeat. The si…

You know that anecdotal interviews are a fairly bad way to collection information, right? This is why humanity developed double-blind studies, statistics etc. We can actually quantify the probabilities of these side effects.

Re: Ritalin Gone Wrong

#50

Post by sek »

tokenadult wrote: post #42
sek wrote: post #20

So Ritalin is just a usual mind boosting drug, it has rebound effects and people develop a tolerance. Like cocaine, MDMA, ephedrine and meth. It differs in it's euphoric and adverse effects, but the positive influence is not permanent. Not a single drug can help you in the long term, you have to develop the abilities yourself. These drugs have the opposite effect, because as long as you take them you don't evolve. Th…

because as long as you take them you don't evolve. Homeostasis of the human body does make any intervention hard to keep long-lasting. I take it you mean "develop" (the word you used in the preceding sentence) for where you wrote "evolve," because of course individuals don't evolve (in the biological sense of the word) but rather populations do by changes in gene frequencies. The story of obesity seems to be that cha…

The word develop is the right one. It is the same translation in German, my mistake.

The big problem is that while you take it, it feels like it. To make the observation that this is not permanent, while influenced, is very difficult. The feeling is very subtle and not obvious like being drunk for example.

You are right, there are extreme forms who need medication. The article suggests, that the whole ADD existence is still not clear and i was diagnosed myself as a kid. I assume that just a little part of the people who take Ritalin really need and benefit from it.

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