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Mastodon hit 10M users

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Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#391

Post by dangus »

sbuttgereit wrote: post #33
nforgerit wrote: post #18

After about 6 months hosting my own little private Mastodon instance, I can say the following things: (1) Whoever cares about that but the atmosphere is nice, cozy, exciting and creative. Zero toxicity and probably several magnitudes more meaningful conversations with people from all around the world. This apparently comes from the kinds of people I could find and connect with. (2) Hosting is relatively easy. I think…

" Zero toxicity and probably several magnitudes more meaningful conversations with people from all around the world. This apparently comes from the kinds of people I could find and connect with. " So long as you lean to progressive worldviews and see insult slinging at those that don't see your way not as being toxic, but rather just expressions of righteous indignation... sure, I could buy that line. A quick perusal…

It sounds like you didn’t find the conservative instance you were looking for, but I’m sure they’re out there.

Here’s the thing though: not all ideas are created equal. You want equal airtime for contrary views, but those contrary views are

1. less popular statistically

2. against the interests of the working class

The alternative worldview to progressivism is basically pro-capital, anti-minority, anti-equality nonsense.

You’re unhappy that progressives hurl insults at regressives, but it should be noted that they are not falling into the trap of the paradox of tolerance.

When one breaks the social contract, they’re no longer under the protections of that contract, and that’s what happens when the regressive ideology sends hate toward the poor, women, LGBTQ+ people, immigrants, and other similarly disenfranchised groups.

The alternative to progressive taxation is regressive taxation. The alternative to equal rights is unequal rights. The alternative to workers’ rights are corporations’ rights. The alternative to freedom of religion is theocracy. The alternative to body autonomy is control by others. The alternative to the scientific method is assumption and ignorance. The alternative to environmental protection is environmental destruction. These contrasting ideologies are not of equal value, objectively.

In other words, if I make a statement like “people shouldn’t own slaves” there is no contrary view that should be entertained.

You want someone to tolerate the intolerance of your desired contrary worldview, but again, you should know that it’s not hypocritical for the tolerant and accepting people to not accept your views.

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#392

Post by dym_sh »

phplovesong wrote: post #386
dym_sh wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if all you wanted to do is look around, it is understandable why giving up was this easy. honestly, if github and HN suffice for all your social needs, you probably dont need anything else. microblogging is not for everyone. but for others, since twitter is just no longer viable, people have been migrating to something that can't be just bought out by yet another rich asshole. plus privacy, extended control over your…

I really dont care that much. To be honest i just wanted to "try it out", and also i cant stand twitter, its just such a echo chamber, and is full of pro russia trolls and trumpists, so i gave that up too. Im sure the trolls will migrate to mastodon too, sooner or later.

the difference is: you choose which people you interact with, and may never even meet a bot account, if you just stick to people you know

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#393

Post by koheripbal »

graypegg wrote: post #337
koheripbal wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Your right to freedom of speech is between you and the government. This is a commonly parroted error. The First Amendment to the US Constitution which protects freedom of expression is mostly between the gov't and you... ...but the CONCEPT of freedom of speech is an ethical concept that goes well beyond the roll of government. It is about ensuring the rights of minority speech and controversial opinions. Speech tha…

I see you’re coming at this from a moral stance where I do agree with you, it’s not great on a personal level to not be challenged. But does that apply here? We’re talking about private citizens, running a publication platform. If you went to your local community newsletter, asked to put in an article saying “this community is full of bigots, and none of you want to hear about it” and they deny including your article…

There is also the concept that once corporations reach as certain SCALE, then they ethically have some responsibilities towards the principles society asks of government.

In 1776, a person shouting obscenities in a pub, would get duly thrown out. He had the freedom to shout in the park, at a coffee shop, in the library, or in any of a thousand other places in town.

Today, political discourse takes places almost entirely online and via private corporations. Google isn't a pub on 2nd ave and 54th street. It's ALL THE ESTABLISHMENTS IN TOWN. ...or at least it, along with 3-4 other of the global tech oligopolies. It's important to note that while massive global tech companies are not formally part of government, they are very integrated with gov't through lobbying, gov't contracts, and direct political sponsorship, and a variety of other individual contacts and arrangements.

As a result of their SCALE of their control, they implicitly inherit some ethical obligations to allow uncomfortable speech to occur.

I don't believe in limitless speech rights - but the current limits are vague and selectively enforced and thus easily susceptible to political bias - which is the most dangerous kind of censorship.

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#394

Post by flerovium »

xorcist wrote: post #270
brabel wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Toxic and hateful people simply get banned I don't know if that's supposed to sound like a good thing, but to me this sounds like a distopian place where anyone that does not align with the "correct worldview" is made to disappear and never be heard of again. If you think "only bad people are toxic", you probably haven't been to many debates where your viewpoint happens to be the minority viewpoint.

> distopian place where anyone that does not align with the "correct worldview" People said exactly the same thing about open relays and spam filters some twenty years ago. A very famous Internet personality kept an open relay around for many years until there was literally no one left to federate with. I worked at a place who thought themselves obligated to keep around copies of all incoming messages for some period…

The analogy is inappropriate:

1. Spam is filtered, not censored. I can still see spam in my "Spam" folder if I want to. Mastodon doesn't merely filter "bad" content; it prevents you from seeing it even if you want to. It would be the equivalent of email actively deleting spam, and "spam" includes an email that suggests vaccines have side effects.

2. It's easy to see that it's not for the benefit of users. They could easily mark things as toxic (perhaps by category, or by who marked it as toxic), and let users filter out what they want. It's not about helping users. It's about controlling users.

3. "Spam" does not include contrary political viewpoints. There's a difference between a viagra ad. I don't want my uncle sending me political rants, but I certainly don't want google deciding I can't read them.

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#395

Post by flerovium »

andrepd wrote: post #378
brabel wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Toxic and hateful people simply get banned I don't know if that's supposed to sound like a good thing, but to me this sounds like a distopian place where anyone that does not align with the "correct worldview" is made to disappear and never be heard of again. If you think "only bad people are toxic", you probably haven't been to many debates where your viewpoint happens to be the minority viewpoint.

What an odd thing to say. You can ban people from your instance of mastodon , just like you could ban, kick, suspend etc, people from your IRC server in olden times. What is wrong with that? How strange to make an act of moderation on your own personal instance into an act of censorship.

He's not complaining about the mastodon technical protocol: he's complaining about the people who control the community and the rules.

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#396

Post by flerovium »

wlonkly wrote: post #381
kitsunesoba wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also known as (if I’m not mistaken) “reply guys”: those who attempt to hijack threads by replying to posts and steering the conversation towards something only tangentially related to the post/poster, almost always in an adversarial manner, rather than starting their own threads for the topics they’re wanting to discuss.

I think "reply guys" are men who tend to always reply to tweets from women, inoffensively but repeatedly,[1] and the thing you're describing is "sealioning"[2]. [1] https://mashable.com/article/twitter-reply-guys [2] https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/sealioning-int...

Honestly, "sealioning" reminds me of the ocean, which reminds me of my favorite shampoo, Ocean Breeze™. You should try it sometime!

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#397

Post by dang »

raspberry1337 wrote: post #277
LBJsPNS wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking from personal experience?

[flagged]

We've banned this account for using HN primarily for ideological battle. That's not allowed here, regardless of which flavor your favor.

https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#398

Post by wolverine876 »

emptysongglass wrote: post #389
wolverine876 wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's one of the larger instances but the top heaviest constitute the majority by far and they all enshrine these policies. So can you provide any evidence? Name this instance? > both sides of the political aisle have become hives of extremism It's laughable. Look at the people in power. What progressive is in any major office: Look at the President, the Minority Leader of the House, the Majority Leader of the Senat…

> So can you provide any evidence? Name this instance? I've already shared the specifics I'm comfortable sharing. I have zero desire to start a witch hunt. > What has the left controlled? The right wing has used governmet power to ban books, educational topics, political freedom for teachers, criminalized gender choices, protests, etc. etc. Even in colleges, the right has shut down dissent, including among faculty (e…

None of that is happening. Those are substantive criticisms. You are not immune from criticism, and complaining about it is a way to avoid addressing the merits.

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#399

Post by wolverine876 »

Escapado wrote: post #108
wolverine876 wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What forum are you talking about. All of Mastadon? Doesn't each instance have its own rules? > As someone who'd consider themselves progressive by the yardstick of 10 years ago but not measured to the new progressives of today ... > The New Left has become unrecognizable to me That's an expected phenomenon. What was progressive yesterday becomes conservative today - think of women's rights, interracial marriage, etc.…

I would consider myself left leaning and still wish to see a lot of progress and change but I disagree with quite a few talking points of what might be considered the current “zeitgeist” of the far left. Would I consider misgendendering a _violent_ hate crime? No. Am I for more inclusion and free choice of gender identity? Yes. Do I think that pure socialism will save humanity? No. Do I think it’s bad we have people…

Who is calling for pure socialism? The only people I hear mention it are reactionary anti-progressives.

Re: Mastodon hit 10M users

#400

Post by wolverine876 »

bluescrn wrote: post #177
_fizz_buzz_ wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Global warming will be by far the biggest challenge going forward. As long as parties on "the right" don't believe in it, or take it seriously or don't address it appropriately there is no way in hell for me to ever consider voting for anything on that spectrum. I can deal with a little over the top wokeness. I cannot deal with the destruction of the planet.

But the catastrophising of climate change is also harmful, and results in people proposing 'solutions' that seem likely to bring about an even faster collapse of civilisation. One 2019 UK report ( https://www.icax.co.uk/pdf/Absolute_Zero_Report.pdf ) proposes a timeline that's been circulating on Twitter, involving the closure of all airports and shutting down all international shipping by 2050, while pricing 40% of…

> catastrophising of climate change is also harmful

What if it is a catastrophe? Should we pretend otherwise?

The word 'catastrophize' implies that the speaker is creating the catastrophe. Climate change sure seems like one to me, whether anyone says it or not.

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