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Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

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Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#121
post #35

I hate to sound like a grumpy old man [especially because I'm not...] but I'm increasingly discouraged by both (1) the media's willingness to abandon any sense of ethics or integrity, and (2) the public's willingness to unquestioningly consume everything that such media produces. We somehow crossed over an invisible line that separates "cheeky hyperbole" from "outright deceit and lies" and nobody noticed.

> We somehow crossed over an invisible line that separates "cheeky hyperbole" from "outright deceit and lies" and nobody noticed

It's been around forever. As good recent-ish example is the Gell-Mann Amnesia Effect:

" Briefly stated, the Gell-Mann Amnesia effect is as follows. You open the newspaper to an article on some subject you know well. In Murray's case, physics. In mine, show business. You read the article and see the journalist has absolutely no understanding of either the facts or the issues. Often, the article is so wrong it actually presents the story backward—reversing cause and effect. I call these the "wet streets cause rain" stories. Paper's full of them. In any case, you read with exasperation or amusement the multiple errors in a story, and then turn the page to national or international affairs, and read as if the rest of the newspaper was somehow more accurate about Palestine than the baloney you just read. You turn the page, and forget what you know.

    — Michael Crichton"

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

bro they gaslit the whole country into being islamophobes for a solid few years there so we'd agree with the invasion of Afghanistan, predicated upon a former CIA asset supposedly having had some hand in 9/11, and then got us to invade Iraq because of unsubstantiated and ultimately false claims as to the existence of "WMDs," and then , afterward, they told us how shamefully evil we were for having spent half of the 0…

>bro they gaslit the whole country into being islamophobes for a solid few years there so we'd agree with the invasion of Afghanistan, predicated upon a former CIA asset supposedly having had some hand in 9/11 The invasion of Afghanistan started like a month after 9/11, and there's basically no evidence Bin Laden himself had CIA connections. The Afghans that harbored him did, but not Bin Laden. I am very critical of…

that's easily the least-interesting part of my post though (and a quick web search will show plenty of evidence both for and against it).

again: our news media temporarily gaslit the entire country into being bigoted against an entire major world religion (not to mention other groups who were unfortunate enough to resemble, at a glance, the caricatures we were gaslit into hating—like Sikhs), solely to further the agenda of foreign-soil invasions, and then told us we were wrong for having ever held these beliefs after the fact, when they were the ones who instilled those beliefs in us in the first place. when you sit down and examine how crazy this all was, it's mind-blowing, both the actual series of events and how quickly we forgot and moved on from it as though it never happened. most people forgot they ever held these beliefs at the time (understandable, as it was quite shameful—even if it wasn't our fault), and, I assume, people who were not born yet will never truly know what it was like, because I guarantee that shit ain't going in the history books. even saying "freedom fries" or playing American Idiot on Spotify today rarely truly jogs people's memory and makes them remember that chapter of their lives and how quickly our beliefs shifted as the result of blatantly state-backed media indoctrination enacted on a susceptibly trusting populace.

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Republican Senate report verified nearly all of the points in the Mueller report. Their incentives were 100% aligned with finding nothing and yet.. https://www.intelligence.senate.gov/sites/default/files/docu... The irony of people in this thread not reading primary sources and instead relying on weird "news" reports that nothing was found is a bit much.

> While the Committee does not describe the final result as a complete picture, this volume provides the most comprehensive description to date of Russia's activities and the threat they posed. Subsequent to the Senate report, has any information corroborated the allegations about Manefort?

Aside from being convicted at trial in two separate Federal jurisdictions and agreeing to forfeit tens of millions of dollars he illicitly earned while working for the Russian billionaire in question you mean? What specific corroboration are you looking for?

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it helps you feel better, this is in a thread about them getting caught and called out. There are some horrifically bad actors in our media landscape right now who are more than happy to lie or label opinion shows as "news" if makes their stock price goes up. It's good to see serious, well respected news outlets like NPR doing the hard work and calling others out on their BS.

> It's good to see serious, well respected news outlets like NPR doing the hard work and calling others out on their BS. While I agree that NPR News bats above average they are not without their blind spots. While they may not chase clickbait or obvious ragebaiting trash, their journalists still latch onto convenient or lazy explanations all of the time.

It's a human institution. It absolutely isn't without flaw. I can think of a couple stories they did I wasn't a big fan of. But this is part of how the system works and why well funded, ethical, serious media is crucial to a functioning society. News agencies will report on each other and help raise the standard of how they are run. Some, NPR included, with have news desks that are devoted to just that and will even report non-flattering news on themselves.

The author of this article is really good about it. He's aired some pretty unflattering, dirty laundry about NPR/PBS, not just other news orgs. Sometimes his pieces are a bit too inside baseball for me, but I appreciate the value they bring to the system as a whole.

An introspective news ecosystem is a healthy one. A healthy news ecosystem helps build a healthier society by rooting out corruption, waste and injustice.

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#125
post #35

I hate to sound like a grumpy old man [especially because I'm not...] but I'm increasingly discouraged by both (1) the media's willingness to abandon any sense of ethics or integrity, and (2) the public's willingness to unquestioningly consume everything that such media produces. We somehow crossed over an invisible line that separates "cheeky hyperbole" from "outright deceit and lies" and nobody noticed.

Regarding point #2,

How have you vetted the NPR article? Is there some ultimate source for this information that would reveal gross negligence or omissions by the author of the article?

I'm not trying to be a jerk about it. It's just that it's incredibly hard to properly fact-check anything you can't look up in an encyclopedia. It feels like this has been a major issue since time immemorial.

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it helps you feel better, this is in a thread about them getting caught and called out. There are some horrifically bad actors in our media landscape right now who are more than happy to lie or label opinion shows as "news" if makes their stock price goes up. It's good to see serious, well respected news outlets like NPR doing the hard work and calling others out on their BS.

> It's good to see serious, well respected news outlets like NPR doing the hard work and calling others out on their BS. While I agree that NPR News bats above average they are not without their blind spots. While they may not chase clickbait or obvious ragebaiting trash, their journalists still latch onto convenient or lazy explanations all of the time.

I recall that NPR had the "Weed is actually bad" book guy on and was pretty much letting him say whatever unchallenged. No opposing viewpoint guest, a bunch of softball questions, and no pushback in general.

This guy totally gave off vibes of using this kernel of truth, these studies on THC in developing brains, and wrapping it in a bunch of FUD to sell his personal brand and books. Oh, and his wife is the scientist not him..

Honestly it felt like a paid advertising spot or a bit of propaganda. At the time I was wondering about the latter because it seemed that NPR had somehow taken a stance AGAINST legalization around the time all that activity was occurring a couple years ago.

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> While the Committee does not describe the final result as a complete picture, this volume provides the most comprehensive description to date of Russia's activities and the threat they posed. Subsequent to the Senate report, has any information corroborated the allegations about Manefort?

Aside from being convicted at trial in two separate Federal jurisdictions and agreeing to forfeit tens of millions of dollars he illicitly earned while working for the Russian billionaire in question you mean? What specific corroboration are you looking for?

> Manafort has not been charged with any crimes related to the Trump campaign or Russian meddling in the 2016 presidential election.

https://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-pol-manafort-witness-mu...

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#128
post #35

I hate to sound like a grumpy old man [especially because I'm not...] but I'm increasingly discouraged by both (1) the media's willingness to abandon any sense of ethics or integrity, and (2) the public's willingness to unquestioningly consume everything that such media produces. We somehow crossed over an invisible line that separates "cheeky hyperbole" from "outright deceit and lies" and nobody noticed.

Regarding point #2, How have you vetted the NPR article? Is there some ultimate source for this information that would reveal gross negligence or omissions by the author of the article? I'm not trying to be a jerk about it. It's just that it's incredibly hard to properly fact-check anything you can't look up in an encyclopedia. It feels like this has been a major issue since time immemorial.

> It's just that it's incredibly hard to properly fact-check anything you can't look up in an encyclopedia.

You can't even use that. Encyclopedias only put the facts they think are important and have space for in the book - it's possible they omit or obfuscate information that would change how one views a person, place, thing, or event.

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#129
post #35

I hate to sound like a grumpy old man [especially because I'm not...] but I'm increasingly discouraged by both (1) the media's willingness to abandon any sense of ethics or integrity, and (2) the public's willingness to unquestioningly consume everything that such media produces. We somehow crossed over an invisible line that separates "cheeky hyperbole" from "outright deceit and lies" and nobody noticed.

>(2) the public's willingness to unquestioningly consume everything that such media produces. What? The predominate pattern today is nobody believing anything the media says. Nothing is true. The earth isn't even fucking round.

I disagree with that in general. Most people distrust some media, not all, and typically it's the "other side's" media.

The fact is most people are stupid and woefully undereducated. That's why media gets away with this - the populace is dumb, and therefore so too is its media. It's just moral panics all the way down, on both sides.

Re: Rolling Stone left out the reason why FBI raided journalist's home

#130
post #35

I hate to sound like a grumpy old man [especially because I'm not...] but I'm increasingly discouraged by both (1) the media's willingness to abandon any sense of ethics or integrity, and (2) the public's willingness to unquestioningly consume everything that such media produces. We somehow crossed over an invisible line that separates "cheeky hyperbole" from "outright deceit and lies" and nobody noticed.

I looked back on Google news and Twitter in Oct 2022 to see contemporary news stories and tweets related to James Gordon Meek to confirm this. While the Daily Beast and the Independent ran stories in this timeframe saying he wasn't raided by the FBI for his work, nearly everyone on Twitter was just tweeting the same clips from Fox News or parroting Tucker Carlson verbatim.

It really goes to show how that aspect of the media just takes over the thinking for their viewers. I wonder how many of these viewers eventually connected the dots that they were so outraged over someone getting arrested for CP.

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