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Leaving China

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Re: Leaving China

#601

Post by [deleted] »

def_true_false wrote: post #326
amrocha wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because US and EU citizens think that "immigrant" is a dirty word for people from poor countries. To all the other people talking about intent to settle or not: read the post. The author lived in China for 20 years and built a family there. They're not an "expat" under any technical definition of the word.

EU citizens mostly don't think in English at all... In most languages you would call someone who moves abroad an emigrant or something similar. From the point of view of the new country, they are obviously an immigrant. The word for people from poor countries is refugee or "economic migrant".

[deleted]

Re: Leaving China

#602

Post by yibg »

alwayslikethis wrote: post #456
yibg wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not a Chinese employer, although you'd be surprised at the comp levels for some companies in the larger city in China. I was working for a US employer with an office in China. EDIT: to provide more details. Total comp of 200k USD and up at some of the larger (e.g. BAT companies) isn't uncommon for the more senior folks.

It's not surprising for the reasons you stated. People from Western countries find living in China undesirable, hence they need to be paid a lot to go there and work.

That’s certainly true for people that are relocated to China from overseas. That was my case. But local Chinese citizens working at one of the BAT companies can also be very highly paid at the more senior levels (say L7 and up). My 200k USD reference was for local comp, not imported expat comp.

Re: Leaving China

#603

Post by kwere »

hayst4ck wrote: post #81
ersiees wrote: post #3

Why do we call people expats and not rich migrants or something like that?

While there are very jaded views about cultural superiority and other things like that. I think the truth is probably less cynical. I can move to japan and marry a Japanese wife, work for a Japanese company, pay Japanese taxes, and speak fluent Japanese, but I will never be Japanese because my skin is white. People can move to America, and as long as you speak English without an accent, there is an assumption that yo…

funnily, foreigners can never acquire chinese citizenship unless some chinese ancestry and/or enough connection in high places. Legal Naturalizations are a few hundreds a year, on a foreign population of 850 thousands

Re: Leaving China

#604

Post by kwere »

nonethewiser wrote: post #52
hayst4ck wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not an expat, but I was considering spending several months in China. After Hong Kong, there was a strong message of "Americans caused this," likewise after covid there was a strong message of "this didn't start in China, this actually started in America." It wasn't just a message of "America is our enemy," but looking at how the People in Hong Kong were robbed of due process from an impartial justice system it…

> "this didn't start in China, this actually started in America." How did the reasoning work here? Not sure if this speaks to poor education, propaganda, something else, or all of the above.

fort derrick narrative

Re: Leaving China

#605

Post by nonethewiser »

yibg wrote: post #224
nonethewiser wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You were paid ~150k+ USD in China, from a Chinese employer?

Not a Chinese employer, although you'd be surprised at the comp levels for some companies in the larger city in China. I was working for a US employer with an office in China. EDIT: to provide more details. Total comp of 200k USD and up at some of the larger (e.g. BAT companies) isn't uncommon for the more senior folks.

Interesting, thanks for sharing. And congrats

Re: Leaving China

#606

Post by nonethewiser »

tiny_ta wrote: post #168
nonethewiser wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you really giving up personal freedom if you’re consciously deciding not to do something out of consideration for others? Usually it becomes a problem because you are infringing on someone else’s personal freedom. So it’s still about maximizing personal freedom in that case.

You're right. Thank you for adding a level of nuance for me to chew on!

Did not expect this reply on the internet. You’ve given me something to chew on as well.

Re: Leaving China

#607

Post by fortuna86 »

RedCondor wrote: post #598
fortuna86 wrote: post #578

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your account was created 15 days ago and is used exclusively for posting inflammatory political nonsense. Also, you do realize that China is the most hyper-capitalist country in the world, don't you?

I'm just a communist programmer that hasn't been here for ages because I got bored of the hive-mind. Literally anything left-of-right-of-centre immediately gets flagged (if not outright banned by the mods), all in service of sheltering little liberal coder worker bees from scary labour propaganda. I came back for a bit to get the latest on ChatGPT, and then noticed that, unsurprisingly, this place is crawling with de…

I didn't ask who you claim to be, i'm pointing out what you are.

If you actually care what China is, which it appears you don't. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authoritarian_capitalism

Re: Leaving China

#608

Post by re-thc »

mytailorisrich wrote: post #592
re-thc wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was already a wave of people considering, planning and did actually leave pre-1997 and around that time. A few did go back to HK afterwards when things looked better but left again due to the current issues. I don't know who was optimistic. The West? Definitely not those in HK. It was a time when anti-China sentiment was high and supported by the media, artists, etc as the trend (vs the crackdown now). There we…

British HK was an act of aggression and a national humiliation for China. The ROC/Taiwan was also happy to see the British go and their regret was that the communists succeeded where they had failed (and in fact did nothing at all as all foreign settlements were kicked out by the PRC).

Why would ROC/Taiwan be happy about it? It helps distract the PRC from ROC/Taiwan. The focus has shifted to Taiwan recently because HK has been "dealt with".

Re: Leaving China

#609

Post by bernawil »

wolverine876 wrote: post #466
duxup wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Chinese diaspora I had no idea how wide it is until a family member married someone from Asia and he explained ot me that his family thinks of themselves as ethnically Chinese, although they're totally disconnected from China.

That's interesting. I learned that historically, China has been many 'nations', with related but different languages - more like Europe than like the US. And I learned that every Chinese government has struggled to hold together these regional peoples under one central government. The current map of China is one variation of many, many historical maps, which vary considerably. (Ask the Tibetans, in particular.) It mi…

It's not that unique, really. It's quite the same as India. I guess it's harder for us westerners to appreciate Chinese diversity because they don't broadcast so much English content about themselves.

If the European Union had been more successful and had a couple more generations totally immersed speaking English, you could imagine some Chinese people in the year 2123 saying 'wow, Europe is actually a whole Civilization politically unified as a nation. Who would have thought".

That'd be true today in a timeline where Napoleon won.

Re: Leaving China

#610

Post by RedCondor »

fortuna86 wrote: post #607
RedCondor wrote: post #598

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm just a communist programmer that hasn't been here for ages because I got bored of the hive-mind. Literally anything left-of-right-of-centre immediately gets flagged (if not outright banned by the mods), all in service of sheltering little liberal coder worker bees from scary labour propaganda. I came back for a bit to get the latest on ChatGPT, and then noticed that, unsurprisingly, this place is crawling with de…

I didn't ask who you claim to be, i'm pointing out what you are. If you actually care what China is, which it appears you don't. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authoritarian_capitalism

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