Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees • Hacker News Board

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#21

Post by omonra » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 2:16 PM UTC

va_coder wrote: post #19

omonra wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm tired of people bringing up 'don't do evil' EVERY time Google does something they dislike. New search results using personal targeting - EVIL! Anti-poaching agreement with Apple - EVIL! Closed down a bagel cafe next to my cubicle - EVIL! Can we all agree that the word Evil has a more sinister use - ie knowing endangering lives, environmental damage, maybe closing press freedoms? And, therefore, we should be more…

No. The "do no evil" was a way of saying let's not be like Microsoft and allow ourself to engage in unfair business practices. Google is now like Microsoft.

"That's like..your opinion, man" :)

So if someone wants to say that Google is becoming like MSFT - say that (incidentally regarding MST being evil I recently read this: http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/2012/01/antitrust_kills....)

But I think that we should not dilute the definition of Evil.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#22

Post by brudgers » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 2:19 PM UTC

mbateman wrote: post #20

omonra wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm tired of people bringing up 'don't do evil' EVERY time Google does something they dislike. New search results using personal targeting - EVIL! Anti-poaching agreement with Apple - EVIL! Closed down a bagel cafe next to my cubicle - EVIL! Can we all agree that the word Evil has a more sinister use - ie knowing endangering lives, environmental damage, maybe closing press freedoms? And, therefore, we should be more…

People are just holding Google to their own standards and terms. If the standards and terms are strange or otherwise inapt, that's on Google.

The phrase, "Hoisted on their own petards," comes to mind.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#23

Post by vaksel » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 2:19 PM UTC

omonra wrote: post #18

josefresco wrote: post #8

I can only imagine how hard it is to have fair negotiations when a prospective employee applies at a competing company only to be told "no thanks" simply because of a hush hush agreement between the executives of said companies. This flies counter with Google's "do no evil" statement and certainly doesn't paint a positive posthumous picture of Jobs.

I'm tired of people bringing up 'don't do evil' EVERY time Google does something they dislike. New search results using personal targeting - EVIL! Anti-poaching agreement with Apple - EVIL! Closed down a bagel cafe next to my cubicle - EVIL! Can we all agree that the word Evil has a more sinister use - ie knowing endangering lives, environmental damage, maybe closing press freedoms? And, therefore, we should be more…

and I'm tired of people excusing any and all scrutiny of bad behavior as alarmist

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#24

Post by furyofantares » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 2:41 PM UTC

omonra wrote: post #18

josefresco wrote: post #8

I can only imagine how hard it is to have fair negotiations when a prospective employee applies at a competing company only to be told "no thanks" simply because of a hush hush agreement between the executives of said companies. This flies counter with Google's "do no evil" statement and certainly doesn't paint a positive posthumous picture of Jobs.

I'm tired of people bringing up 'don't do evil' EVERY time Google does something they dislike. New search results using personal targeting - EVIL! Anti-poaching agreement with Apple - EVIL! Closed down a bagel cafe next to my cubicle - EVIL! Can we all agree that the word Evil has a more sinister use - ie knowing endangering lives, environmental damage, maybe closing press freedoms? And, therefore, we should be more…

Can we agree that limiting the career opportunities of your employees and firing recruiters who will not take part in this illegal practice is nothing like taking away bagels or personalizing search results? It's very close to the regular meaning of "evil", harming people for your own gain, illegally and without justification.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#25

Post by gvb » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 2:43 PM UTC

omonra wrote: post #18

josefresco wrote: post #8

I can only imagine how hard it is to have fair negotiations when a prospective employee applies at a competing company only to be told "no thanks" simply because of a hush hush agreement between the executives of said companies. This flies counter with Google's "do no evil" statement and certainly doesn't paint a positive posthumous picture of Jobs.

I'm tired of people bringing up 'don't do evil' EVERY time Google does something they dislike. New search results using personal targeting - EVIL! Anti-poaching agreement with Apple - EVIL! Closed down a bagel cafe next to my cubicle - EVIL! Can we all agree that the word Evil has a more sinister use - ie knowing endangering lives, environmental damage, maybe closing press freedoms? And, therefore, we should be more…

I'm in total agreement with your statement with respect to when "Google does something they dislike."

That is not the case here as Google and the others embroiled in this scandal were evil in that they willfully broke antitrust laws.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#26

Post by rooshdi » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 2:52 PM UTC

omonra wrote: post #21

va_coder wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. The "do no evil" was a way of saying let's not be like Microsoft and allow ourself to engage in unfair business practices. Google is now like Microsoft.

"That's like..your opinion, man" :) So if someone wants to say that Google is becoming like MSFT - say that (incidentally regarding MST being evil I recently read this: http://econlog.econlib.org/archives/2012/01/antitrust_kills.... ) But I think that we should not dilute the definition of Evil.

But I think that we should not dilute the definition of Evil.

Tell that to the employee who was "terminated within the hour."

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#27

Post by foodhomie » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 2:53 PM UTC

josefresco wrote: post #8

I can only imagine how hard it is to have fair negotiations when a prospective employee applies at a competing company only to be told "no thanks" simply because of a hush hush agreement between the executives of said companies. This flies counter with Google's "do no evil" statement and certainly doesn't paint a positive posthumous picture of Jobs.

It seems to me that Jobs orchestrated the whole ago affair, approaching key managers in various companies to set up this agreement. If Google gets the Evil tag for the decisions of some executives then surely Apple should be described a duck, perhaps more do since Jobs was Apple for all intents and purposes

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#28

Post by rapind » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 3:10 PM UTC

neves wrote: post #15

The problem is not just that the employees have less options where to find a job. The real problem is that the employees don't know about the agreement! If I work at Pixar and prospect Intel for a job, they will tell my boss and my carreer at Pixar will be messed for ever. I had a boss that liked to fire employees who he knew were searching for jobs elsewhere. He would announce in job sites good offers asking for can…

I would have applied to one writing "I'm interested in working for you because my current boss is a douchebag who posts fake jobs to try and get us to apply to them."

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#29

Post by michaelochurch » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 3:18 PM UTC

I am surprised that people are surprised by this.

Who do VCs spend their skiing trips with: ramen-fed, sleep-deprived startup founders, or other VCs? Of course, they hang out with each other.

Same with executives at large companies. They might be nominally "competitors", but they've already learned that they have more in common with one another than with employees in the companies they run.

Re: Steve Jobs personally asked Eric Schmidt to stop poaching employees

#30

Post by jcslzr » Sat, Jan 28, 2012, 3:20 PM UTC

That is what is funny about all those people that treat ¨conspiracy theories¨ as nuts. Is like corruption must have a limit just because they have not seen it first hand.