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More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

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Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#141

Post by jimkleiber »

hgsgm wrote: post #82
jimkleiber wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised you didn't include anything about meeting people for work, romance, friendship, or other social benefit, as for many, that can be a huge part of college.

That's only because almost everyone desirable goes there. If people stopped going, they could meet elsewhere.

I think people have a lot of shared context in college that they don't often have elsewhere. Depending on the college, but especially in the US campus experience, people live together, eat together, study together, party together, and more. So I don't think it's just the desirability of people.

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#142

Post by morpheuskafka »

pclmulqdq wrote: post #26

College seems to have ~3 uses from students' perspectives: 1. A trade school for technical professionals who actually need specialist education (scientists, engineers, lawyers, doctors, etc.) 2. A finishing school for the elite 3. A blood sports arena for the brilliant to complete for professorships (almost all of whom will lose and be saddled with 6 figures of debt and 7 figures of opportunity cost) A lot of people…

> fields that don't truly need the education

Even if that's true, isn't part of the problem that a lot of those office jobs that don't absolutely need the knowledge still expect a bachelor's degree? Even if it was nothing more than "finishing school," you're going to have a hard time finding a job in HR, sales, etc. without college.

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#143

Post by thomastjeffery »

hgsgm wrote: post #82
jimkleiber wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm surprised you didn't include anything about meeting people for work, romance, friendship, or other social benefit, as for many, that can be a huge part of college.

That's only because almost everyone desirable goes there. If people stopped going, they could meet elsewhere.

The trouble is: where?

The alternative is a variety of places, and practically all of them have some kind of tax; where it be coffee, alcohol, or some kind of membership fee.

What we are missing is called, "the third place".

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#145

Post by morelisp »

zoogeny wrote: post #65
azinman2 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It also grows the intellectual souls, exposing people to far more depth of thought. It also builds professional networks. If a person is smart enough to receive it, more education is almost always good. Of course money is a factor, and schools have gotten insanely expensive. I’m glad to hear that more people are finding alternative routes - it shouldn’t be that everyone needs college because quite frankly many career…

Your post makes me consider what other avenues to achieve the growth of intellectual souls and exposure to depth of thought could exist other than paid-for highly-structured institutions. I think people wax poetically about their own experiences without really considering the experiences of others. We've had free public libraries for centuries now. We've had a pretty open Internet for decades. There is literally noth…

> We've had free public libraries for centuries now.

Not even a century and a half, really. The first Carnegie library was opened in 1883, for example.

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#146

Post by [deleted] »

xyzelement wrote: post #54
azinman2 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It also grows the intellectual souls, exposing people to far more depth of thought. It also builds professional networks. If a person is smart enough to receive it, more education is almost always good. Of course money is a factor, and schools have gotten insanely expensive. I’m glad to hear that more people are finding alternative routes - it shouldn’t be that everyone needs college because quite frankly many career…

I think you are referring to something on one hand very valuable, on the other hand it's very easy to graduate college without learning that, and I think colleges themselves in recent decades are pivoting away from. A hundred+ years ago when "almost nobody" went to college, college was a place for those hungry and willing to sacrifice for intellectual growth. Nowadays college is a baseline consumer good that "almost…

[deleted]

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#147

Post by 999900000999 »

newhotelowner wrote: post #4

My daughter got rejected from one of the UC. They received 130+k application for 6k openings.

I'll guess ether Berkeley or UCLA? That's why you apply to more than one.

Even the Cal States aren't bad schools, you can get a quality education at a fraction of the price.

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#148

Post by Ekaros »

vasco wrote: post #136
TheMaskedCoder wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The sports side of college is bizarre. I think it is descended from British upper class amateur athletics, but it makes no sense in modern times. Athletics has nothing to do with education. Nothing at all. Star athletes are there only so they can get noticed by scouts. Universities keep teams around for the money. They ought to stop pretending there's any connection to education and replace it all with minor leagues…

They have something to do with it in the sense that many people practice them and they need to practice them growing up in order to be able to do it as a job. You also cannot discount the impact of athletics programs on national defense and the programs that were done by multiple presidents to keep people active and healthy. Sports have this quality among cultural activities that they tend to improve your body and re…

But why connect it to education? Why not make it general program for all ages? Why not encourage community run programs for teams consisting for example company workers, or local neighbourhood teams? The education ends very quickly and it is the older than that people who could really benefit from these activities.

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#149

Post by BashiBazouk »

I don't subscribe to college as primarily a way to pump out worker bees. People should have access to learning beyond that to which ends only in employment. Cut the bloated administration, figure out how to lower costs and tailor to different learning models and schedules. Make it affordable and not to difficult to register for those in the community who are post college or post college age to take classes. Don't be afraid to teach trades. Adapt.

Re: More students are turning away from college and toward apprenticeships

#150

Post by nemo44x »

alsaaro wrote: post #88

As someone who has worked two of the most intensive blue collar jobs, people should be wary of romanticizing blue collar work. Blue collar workers are expected to really work at their jobs. White collar workers can chill if there is no work to be done, or be sent home early with pay, or take a relaxation day and just browse the internet and listen to podcasts. They have perks, you see white collar workers leaving wor…

If it requires a license or certification then it’s generally a well paying career with options for the ambitious. It’s why you see so many small shops because it’s very accessible to start your own business after gaining years of experience, reputation, and connections.
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