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Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

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Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#151

Wow - this is just wild. I've seen lots of arguments around "AI won't take everyone's job, it will just open up new areas for new jobs." Even if you take that with the benefit of the doubt (which I don't really think is warranted): 1. You don't need to take everyone's job. You just need to take a shitload of people's jobs. I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality,…

> I mean, does anyone think that things like human translators, medical transcriptionists, court reporters, etc. will exist as jobs at all in 10-20 years?

Before mechanical alarm clocks, there were people paid to tap on windows to wake them up.

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#152

Wow - this is just wild. I've seen lots of arguments around "AI won't take everyone's job, it will just open up new areas for new jobs." Even if you take that with the benefit of the doubt (which I don't really think is warranted): 1. You don't need to take everyone's job. You just need to take a shitload of people's jobs. I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality,…

Think of people who have jobs like archaeology, digging up bones. The only way these jobs can exist is if technology has taken over much of the grunt work of production.

As for human translators, the need for them far, far exceeds the number of them. Have you ever needed translation help? I sure have, but no human translator was available or was too expensive.

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#153

Wow - this is just wild. I've seen lots of arguments around "AI won't take everyone's job, it will just open up new areas for new jobs." Even if you take that with the benefit of the doubt (which I don't really think is warranted): 1. You don't need to take everyone's job. You just need to take a shitload of people's jobs. I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality,…

It is very obvious there is a mass unemployment wave coming - or at least a mass "retraining" wave, though the new jobs "teaching AIs" or whatever remain to be seen. I hope everyone currently just questioning whether this will happen now is prepared to state it with conviction in the coming months and fight for some sort of social protection program for all these displaced people, because the profits from this new world aren't getting distributed without a fight.

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#154

Wow - this is just wild. I've seen lots of arguments around "AI won't take everyone's job, it will just open up new areas for new jobs." Even if you take that with the benefit of the doubt (which I don't really think is warranted): 1. You don't need to take everyone's job. You just need to take a shitload of people's jobs. I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality,…

> Imagine if you spent your entire career working on NLP, and now find GPT-4 will run rings around whatever you've done. What do you do now?

I have been doing NLP since 1993. Before ca. 1996, there were mostly rule-based systems that were just toys. They lacked robustness. Then statistical systems came up and things like spell-checking (considering context when doing it), part of speech tagging and eventually even parsing started to work. Back then, people could still only analyze sentences with fewer than 40 words - the rest was often cut off. Then came more and more advanced machine learning models (decision trees, HMMs, CRFs), first a whole zoo, and then support vector regressors (SVM/SVR) ate everything else for breakfast. Then in machine learning a revival of neural networks happened, because better training algorithms were discovered, more data became available and cheap GPUs were suddenly available because kids needed them for computer games. This led to what some call the ¨deep learning revolution¨. Tasks like speech recognition where people for decades tried to squeeze out another half percent drop in error rate suddenly made huge jumps, improving quality by 35% - so jaws dropped. (But today's models like BERT still only can process 512 words of text.)

So it is understandable that people worry at several ends. To lose jobs, to render ¨NLP redundant¨. I think that is not merited. Deep neural models have their own set of problems, which need to be solved. In particular, lack of transparency and presence of different types of bias, but also the size and energy consumption. Another issue is that for many tasks, no much data is actually available. The big corps like Google/Meta etc. push the big ¨foundational¨ models because in the consumer space there is ample data available. But there are very important segments (notably in the professional space - applications for accountants, lawyers, journalists, pharmacologists - all of which I have conducted projects in/for), where training data can be constructed for a lot of money, but it will never reach the size of the set of today`s FB likes. There will always be a need for people who build bespoke systems or customize systems for particular use cases or languages, so my bet is things will stay fun and exciting.

Also note that "NLP" is a vast field that includes much more than just word based language models. The field of propositional (logical) semantics, which is currently disconnected from the so-called foundational models, is much more fascinating than, say, chatGPT if you ask me. The people there, linguist-logicians like Johan Bos identify laws that restrict what a sentence can mean, given its structure, and rules how to map from sentences like "The man gave the girl a rose" to their functor-argument structure - something like "give(man_0, rose_1)¨ - which models the "who did what to whom?". When such symbolic approaches are integrated with neural foundational models, there will be a much bigger breakthrough than what we are seeing today (mark my words!). Because these tools, for instance Lambda Discourse Representation Theory and friends, permit you to represent how the meaning of "man bites dog" is different from "dog bites man".

So whereas today`s models SEEM a bit intelligent, but are actually only sophisticated statistical parrots, the future will bring something more principled. Then the ¨ "hallucinations" of models will stop.

I am glad I am in the field of NLP - it has been getting more exciting every year since 1993, and the best time still lies ahead!

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#155
post #51
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> something as powerful as what I created Could you give us more detail? It sounds intriguing.

I developed a new static analysis (a type system, to be precise) to guarantee statically that a concurrent/distributed system could fail gracefully in case of (D)DoS or other causes of resource exhaustion. Other people in that field developed comparable tools to statically guarantee algorithmic space or time complexity of implementations (including the good use of timeouts/resource sandboxes if necessary). Or type sy…

Is there a good resource (a review paper maybe?) to get an overview over such programming language / type system topics?

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#156
post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Less bullshit jobs. Society needs doctors, nurses, plumbers and teachers not tech bros.

With this kind of mindset, we'd still be using lead pipes and letting blood. Doctors and plumbers might make society work, but technology drives society forward.

Sure. But recruiting scheduling coordinators do not. Those people would better serve society stringing up new HVDC lines, which the current model does not incentivize.

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#157
post #135

Wow - this is just wild. I've seen lots of arguments around "AI won't take everyone's job, it will just open up new areas for new jobs." Even if you take that with the benefit of the doubt (which I don't really think is warranted): 1. You don't need to take everyone's job. You just need to take a shitload of people's jobs. I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality,…

> I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality, etc., I see where you’re coming from, but is this really the main source of the inequality? Based on numbers relating to workers’ diminishing share of profits, it seems to be that the capital class has been able to take a bigger piece of the profit pie without sharing. In the past, companies have shared profits more wide…

> Based on numbers relating to workers’ diminishing share of profits, it seems to be that the capital class has been able to take a bigger piece of the profit pie without sharing.

Consider the elephant in the room:

https://www.federalbudgetinpictures.com/federal-spending-per...

Where does that money come from?

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#158

Wow - this is just wild. I've seen lots of arguments around "AI won't take everyone's job, it will just open up new areas for new jobs." Even if you take that with the benefit of the doubt (which I don't really think is warranted): 1. You don't need to take everyone's job. You just need to take a shitload of people's jobs. I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality,…

There are three 'markets' for translators:

* Verbal translation, where accuracy is usually important enough to want to also have a human onboard since humans still have an easier time with certain social clues.

* High-culture translation, where there's a lot to personal choice and explaining it. GPT can give out many versions but can't yet sufficiently explain its reasoning, nor would its tastes necessarily match that of humans.

* Technical translations for manuals and such. This market will be under severe threat from GPTs, though for high-accuracy cases one would still want a human editor just in case.

All in all, GPT will contract the market, but many human translators will be fine. There's still areas where you'd still want a human, and deskilling isn't a bug threat - a human can decide to immerse and get experience directly, and many will still do so by necessity.

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#159

The PR folks at my current company are in full panic mode on Linkedin, judging from the passive-aggressive tone of their posts (sometimes very nearly begging customers not to use ChatGPT and friends). They fully understand that LLMs are stealing lunch money from established information retrieval industry players selling overpriced search algorithms. For a long time, my company was deluded about being protected by ins…

> There is no good reason this should not work everywhere else, in exactly the same way. Take for example a large retailer who has a large internal knowledge base. Train an LLM on that corpus, ask the knowledge base any question. Since LLM’s can’t scope themselves to be strictly true or accurate, there are indeed good reasons, like liability for false claims and added traditional support burden from incorrect guidanc…

"LLM’s can’t scope themselves to be strictly true or accurate"

This isn't true though the techniques to do so are 1. Not as yet widespread 2. Decrease the generality of the model and its perceived effectiveness.

Re: Anyone else witnessing a panic inside NLP orgs of big tech companies?

#160

Wow - this is just wild. I've seen lots of arguments around "AI won't take everyone's job, it will just open up new areas for new jobs." Even if you take that with the benefit of the doubt (which I don't really think is warranted): 1. You don't need to take everyone's job. You just need to take a shitload of people's jobs. I think a lot of our current sociological problems, problems associated with wealth inequality,…

This is possibly a death spiral. GPT is only possible because it's been trained on the work humans have learned to do and then put out in the world. Now GPT is as good as them and will put them all out of work. How can it improve if the people who fed it are now jobless?

Literally everything you do online is training data. This comment and discussion is future training data. Your browser history is logged somewhere and will be training data. Your OS probably spies on what you do...training data. It's training data all the way down. And they've hardly begun to take into account the physical world, video, music, etc. as training data.
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