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Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

blog.alexellis.io

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Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#712
I'm not too familiar with docker infra at large, but could the docker hub in principle act just as a namespace such that the opensource projects could have the images hosted elsewhere, but docker hub just redirects them there, so saving on the bandwidth on those?

I suppose there are hand-wavy business reasons not to do that, but somehow I feel that would:

  1. Still keep themselves in the loop and relevant, owning the namespace/hub/main registry
  2. Offset the costs of those that they don't want to deal with (push them to ghcr or whatever)
  3. Preserve some notion of goodwill in not braking the whole dockerverse

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#713

It was always unbelievable too me how much they hosted for free. I recklessly pushed over 100gbs of containers the last years, all free. Never made sense to me, even google doesn't do this anymore.

There is a way to go from that status quo to a new and sustainable one; it requires actual engineering of the state change.

That has not seemed to have happened here, or not happened well.

Nobody expected it to be free forever; I think we expected the transition to be a lot more orderly. There have been years to prepare.

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#714

You know what I love about Java’s library ecosystem? You configure your project to use the de-facto ones… OR you configure your project (not your system’s user profile!) to use your own internal registry/repo And all the repo software supports pull-through from every other repo, so you cache all your dependencies however you want and have full control over everything. Why does pretty much no other ecosystem do this?

Cargo and NPM and PyPi and RubyGems and likely others all definitely support this too.

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#715
post #667

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> APT ... has a number of limitations ...and crucial features, like having security fixes backported.

What you're alluding to is an Ubuntu decision about what goes into their repos, and has nothing to do with apt itself.

If anything it's usually a Debian decision. But it's more than that.

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#716
From the article:

> If you are able to completely delete your organisation, then you could re-create it as a free personal account. That should be enough to reserve the name to prevent hostile take-over. Has Docker forgotten Remember leftpad? > > This is unlikely that large projects can simply delete their organisation and all its images. > > If that's the case, and you can tolerate some downtime, you could try the following: > - Create a new personal user account > - Mirror all images and tags required to the new user account > - Delete the organisation > - Rename the personal user account to the name of the organisation

Seems like no?

We cannot rename personal accounts on Docker Hub in 2023. There is no such feature in account settings, and here is the related issue: https://github.com/docker/roadmap/issues/44

So, at the moment, any public organization images are doomed to be lost, if they won't pay.

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#717
This is cool and I explain why: - cool because advocate for a proprietary technology hidden behind Open Source and Free Software purism is a fallacy - cool because by theses actions you improve their business against users freedoms

And most of all, Cool because I hope you and other will take the time to ask yourself before advocating a technology:

Is this technology good for my rights and by the way for knowledge of all.

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#718
post #685

I suppose BitTorrent for Images should be a thing (again?) Discussions of decentralization and redundancy always come up in software/system design and development, but we seem to always gravitate to bottlenecks and full dependency on single entities for the tools we "need".

Good point. A dual system would be ideal. http to ensure coverage, bt to achieve network effects on the popular images. Presumably a few - nginx and what not - have a high %

Many (most?) BitTorrent clients support web seeding[1] by a regular HTTP server.

A public registry could do web seeding, with bandwidth restrictions if needed, to ensure availability.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BitTorrent#Web_seeding

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#719
If you are using containerd then you might find the "hosts" section of the configuration file useful: https://github.com/containerd/containerd/blob/main/docs/host...

You could mirror the images to another registry of your choosing and then use containerd configuration as a stopgap until you update all of your `FROM`/`image` fields.

Re: Docker is deleting Open Source organisations - what you need to know

#720

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Makes perfect sense to me, sadly. The dependencies are specified in excessively, that's why everyone is shipping Ubuntu. This is caused by and further facilitates the development style of "do not track what we use, just ship everything". Also, the dependencies are specified in container images, which themselves are derivative artifacts and not the original source code, and these dependencies often change in different…

It doesn't have to be a choice of containers or nix though. You can put your nix built applications into a container just fine. You can also pull an image from somewhere else and shove nix stuff into it as well. There is definitely a bit of a learning curve but the time investment is frequently over exaggerated. I see it as similar to the borrow checker in rust. Yes, you have to spend some time and also learn about t…

This is true, I can put nix apps in a container. It improves the reproducibility of builds, but it still wastes disk space, because the container is still based on layers and not packages.

> There is definitely a bit of a learning curve but the time investment is frequently over exaggerated

I'm not talking about the learning curve and its time investment, I'm talking about design problems. Nix's invasiveness is completely unnecessary in modern Linux, it makes its installation a very special case and requires lots of patches to just get stuff to work in nix. The fact that nix patches built binaries so that they point to correct shared libraries locations is a crutch which shouldn't be there in the first place.

It also tries to reimplement pretty much every package manager and build tool, even if they already work well and provide the reproducibility guarantees, including cargo, poetry, npm/yarn. This is a time investment, but it doesn't help me build software that is more robust and correct, that part is already handled for me. Instead, it just worsens the DX, as it forces me to use tools non-native to the ecosystem without first-class support for commonly used features.

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