Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video) • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#21

Post by wkornewald » Thu, Jan 26, 2012, 10:37 PM UTC

squeee wrote: post #18

wkornewald wrote: post #3

Hi, I'm one of the founders of pentotype. We're creating a new kind of wireframing software and we'd really love to hear your feedback. We have been working on this for more than half a year now, doing some customer interviews and building a prototype. We're planning on launching an MVP in a few months, but we've gotten to a point where we'd really appreciate some broader feedback. Especially, we would like to know i…

I too find it irritating when other wireframing tools don't have that one thing I am looking for. The ability to easily create your own on the fly sounds interesting. Handful of questions: Drawing with a finger/pen on a tablet... will the lines auto-smooth? Is there a scripting language under new elements? Would I be able to combine elements and make a reusable gallery type super element?! Will my clients have to ins…

We love questions. :)

Lines will be smoothed, similar to how the Bamboo iPad app does it. Our prototype already does that. Does this answer your question?

You'll be able to create custom (even grouped) widgets and store them for easy access (e.g. if they're complicated to draw every time). We also plan to make pentotype even recognize your custom elements.

Clients won't need to install anything because pentotype is web-based. They just can point their browser at a URL and interact with the wireframe and leave comments.

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#22

Post by twanschik » Thu, Jan 26, 2012, 10:40 PM UTC

mark_ellul wrote: post #20

rhizome wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in this context it would involve some kind of media-transformation, say from paper to mockup via webcam.

I interpretted the recognition to be of the actual wireframes itself, which allows for the user experience at the wireframe stage. Is that correct?

You interpretted it correctly. The actual wireframes itself are recognized on-line so you can directly move elements around or test your wireframe.

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#23

Post by MortenK » Thu, Jan 26, 2012, 10:41 PM UTC

rhizome wrote: post #6

I had a different sense of "recognition" going in than what was portrayed in the video.

Me too. I was really hoping for an app that could take a scan of a handwritten diagram / mockup, and "recognize" the shapes, converting them into objects that could be manipulated (resized, removed, repositioned etc) through the app.

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#24

Post by squeee » Thu, Jan 26, 2012, 10:53 PM UTC

wkornewald wrote: post #21

squeee wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I too find it irritating when other wireframing tools don't have that one thing I am looking for. The ability to easily create your own on the fly sounds interesting. Handful of questions: Drawing with a finger/pen on a tablet... will the lines auto-smooth? Is there a scripting language under new elements? Would I be able to combine elements and make a reusable gallery type super element?! Will my clients have to ins…

We love questions. :) Lines will be smoothed, similar to how the Bamboo iPad app does it. Our prototype already does that. Does this answer your question? You'll be able to create custom (even grouped) widgets and store them for easy access (e.g. if they're complicated to draw every time). We also plan to make pentotype even recognize your custom elements. Clients won't need to install anything because pentotype is w…

Yes, thank you, when and how much?

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#25

Post by gotrythis » Thu, Jan 26, 2012, 11:03 PM UTC

wkornewald wrote: post #3

Hi, I'm one of the founders of pentotype. We're creating a new kind of wireframing software and we'd really love to hear your feedback. We have been working on this for more than half a year now, doing some customer interviews and building a prototype. We're planning on launching an MVP in a few months, but we've gotten to a point where we'd really appreciate some broader feedback. Especially, we would like to know i…

I've been designing software for 20 years, reviewed over a dozen wireframing tools, and I still use Photoshop. But Photoshop sucks for low fidelity comps and creating interaction guides.

For the low fidelity comps, I bought myself a LiveScripe echopen so I could draw out things and import them for manipulation, instead of throwing out paper, etc, but I haven't explored it to its full potential yet. The benefits are that I can easily import and manipulate drawings and that I can record audio as I draw, and then click on a drawing to hear what I (or clients) said at the moment I drew what I clicked on. Very helpful for remembering all the ideas and flow when I get to a computer.

Your solution looks fantastic for low fidelity. It would be super cool if I could control it with that pen like this: http://www.livescribe.com/store/20070723002/paper-tablet/p-4...

The next step is when I start replacing low fidelity with medium fidelity photoshop mockups. Once approved/done, it goes to real graphic artists and coders. It would be great if I can easily copy selections of a photoshop comp over specific parts of drawings to move it's fidelity up the ladder piece by piece and page by page as components and pages are done, and get feedback on it as I go. With an easy way to keep track of what has been updated recently or commented on and by who, and a way to mark off comments that are addressed, and to know who has seen what and if they approve or not with comments.

The other thing I wonder about is how you organize things. I'm currently designing a giant app for all platforms. The specs are huge and it has lots of subtle animation state changes etc that might be challenging to map out, where clicking makes just one bit of the page do something, not going to a whole page. (Like opening a menu or flipping a card to see what's on the back.) It would be nice if it could somehow deal with that and deal with reusing sections on several mockups for different media. I'd want to switch between the same page (if it exists) for tablet, phone, and PC. And when I upgrade the fidelity of an elment on one mockup, it would replace it everywhere else it is used.

So, that's my initial thoughts on what my dream wireframing tool would be.

Generally love what you are doing and want in immediately to see if it speeds up things for me! :-)

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#26

Post by wkornewald » Thu, Jan 26, 2012, 11:10 PM UTC

squeee wrote: post #24

wkornewald wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We love questions. :) Lines will be smoothed, similar to how the Bamboo iPad app does it. Our prototype already does that. Does this answer your question? You'll be able to create custom (even grouped) widgets and store them for easy access (e.g. if they're complicated to draw every time). We also plan to make pentotype even recognize your custom elements. Clients won't need to install anything because pentotype is w…

Yes, thank you, when and how much?

Wow. :) We're working as fast as we can. In a few months we want to release an MVP. The pricing will be based on monthly subscriptions, but we haven't decided on a pricing scheme, yet.

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#27

Post by wkornewald » Thu, Jan 26, 2012, 11:32 PM UTC

gotrythis wrote: post #25

wkornewald wrote: post #3

Hi, I'm one of the founders of pentotype. We're creating a new kind of wireframing software and we'd really love to hear your feedback. We have been working on this for more than half a year now, doing some customer interviews and building a prototype. We're planning on launching an MVP in a few months, but we've gotten to a point where we'd really appreciate some broader feedback. Especially, we would like to know i…

I've been designing software for 20 years, reviewed over a dozen wireframing tools, and I still use Photoshop. But Photoshop sucks for low fidelity comps and creating interaction guides. For the low fidelity comps, I bought myself a LiveScripe echopen so I could draw out things and import them for manipulation, instead of throwing out paper, etc, but I haven't explored it to its full potential yet. The benefits are t…

Thank you, also for the note about the LiveScripe echopen. How essential is it for you to have live audio recordings?

We'd like to start with screen flows, but we want to support more stateful element changes in future releases, too. Would you like to do a Skype call with us in the next few weeks and talk a little bit more about your workflow?

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#28

Post by jaysonelliot » Fri, Jan 27, 2012, 12:20 AM UTC

I've been doing UX for fifteen years, and I feel like I've tried every software solution, but nothing beats paper for concepting. My wireframing tools end up being used for documenting ideas, but they're terrible when you're generating ideas.

The problems in this video are exactly the problems I face.

The only place I had a problem with the solution was the idea that drawing on a tablet is the same as drawing on paper. For me, it's just not. My dream solution would let me draw on paper to begin with.

That said, the solution here still looks better than trying to develop ideas in Visio/Omnigraffle/Axure/InDesign/Keynote/whatever by orders of magnitude.

I'm very excited to try this out.

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#29

Post by twanschik » Fri, Jan 27, 2012, 12:28 AM UTC

jaysonelliot wrote: post #28

I've been doing UX for fifteen years, and I feel like I've tried every software solution, but nothing beats paper for concepting. My wireframing tools end up being used for documenting ideas, but they're terrible when you're generating ideas. The problems in this video are exactly the problems I face. The only place I had a problem with the solution was the idea that drawing on a tablet is the same as drawing on pape…

On our Bamboo tablet the feeling is a lot better than on a iPad for example. But we're optimistic about iPad and Android tablets getting closer to the paper feeling.

Re: Ask HN: Review our Startup: Wireframing via Recognition (video)

#30

Post by sayer » Fri, Jan 27, 2012, 1:25 AM UTC

MortenK wrote: post #23

rhizome wrote: post #6

I had a different sense of "recognition" going in than what was portrayed in the video.

Me too. I was really hoping for an app that could take a scan of a handwritten diagram / mockup, and "recognize" the shapes, converting them into objects that could be manipulated (resized, removed, repositioned etc) through the app.

I am waiting for this app as well. With AR-style overlay of the already placed wireframes over the camera picture, making positioning/sizing very easy: just move your tablet, and press the shutter once the new stuff is in the right place. lets start this with OpenCV on Android.