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Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

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631–640 of 809 posts

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#631
Do you combine an ERV or and HRV into your air quality module?

My parents live have oil heat (water radiators) and a classic ducted A/C unit in Installation Climate zone 5A (Moist - New England) and I'd love to get them to a product like yours. ERV/HRV functionality for air quality would really help and would set this product apart from current offerings in the market.

I don't really know how to do proper ventilation/humidity control in that climate without an ERV.

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#633
I've seen other construction related businesses try to go direct and it is extremely difficult. By going direct to the homeowner you are targeting the venn diagram union of "people who are willing & able to do the work themselves" and "people who will pay more"

How are you going to build your service network? You say you will "connect them with a contractor to do the actual install." But contractors make their money on equipment sales, not on labor. I bought my residential HVAC system direct from a friend and it took me 3 weeks calling around to find a contractor that would do the install and THAT was only because of the same friend connection.

Who are the decision makers in your target market exactly? Wil Joe Homeowner be deciding? Will you pursue developers who install and build? Are you pursuing multi-family complexes and engineers will be specifying the equipment? Each of these will require you to provide value above and beyond what they are receiving now and it's not clear what your value proposition is.

>> "contractors struggle with installs because of the difficulty of properly sizing the system, and understanding if your duct work is compatible with a heat pump"

What? How could duct work possibly be incompatible with a heat pump? Any forced air system is already ready for hot or cold air. Additionally if you are banking on contractor unfamiliarity or incompetence as part of your business plan, you are in for a rude surprise.

One other headwind is that you're VC funded. No one wants to buy a HVAC unit from a company with a 5-7yr liquidation event timeline. If you do go into any other channel than direct to home owner, no one wants to SELL a unit that may not exist in 7 years. How will support work? What about parts? A well built machine could be in working for 15 years (or longer) and the question everyone has is: will you?

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#634
Hey, so I've been having some issues with my heating and cooling system at home. It's been causing me some headaches, from high energy bills to frequent breakdowns, poor air quality, uneven heating and cooling, and loud operation. I'm tired of dealing with all these problems, and I'm thinking about upgrading to a more modern and efficient solution like a heat pump.

I was reading up on the benefits and I think it could really make a difference. But to be honest, I'm not really sure where to start or what type of heat pump would be best for my home.

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#635
I appreciate those trying to start in the HVAC space, while holding the many criticisms brought up in the other comments.

I have a different take - what would it take to make a heat pump system as rebuildable and easily maintainable to last more than the 10year expected lifetime? You could price in options for a longer warranty akin what 'Speed Queen' does with their clothes washers.

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#636
post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Solar and wind do not come close to handling peak loads right, especially when the weather doesn't cooperate.

Batteries and dams can be used to store energy. It doesn't have to be sunny and/or windy all the time. Excess generation capacity takes care of the issue. Regardless, burning natural gas for heat is burning 100% fossil fuels for heat, while electricity is not generally generated 100% by fossil fuels. Using electricity is still a huge improvement even now. And if you're using baseboard heating (electric), heat pumps a…

If batteries and dams are so effective, why were Germany and Texas caught off guard during the last few years?

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#637
I’ve been wondering lately how small one of the indoor inverter heads could be scaled down to. Specifically, whether it could approach the footprint of a ducted heating outlet (with most of it under the floor). It seems like it would be more efficient to run coolant lines to the heads rather than blowing all that air through ducts as well as making it easier to have separate temp zones in the house. Does anyone know what the physical limitations are?

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#638
post #585

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a straightforward way to estimate whether a small (24 kbtu), medium (36 kbtu), or large (48 kbtu) unit would be most appropriate for a given home?

I think the proper method used by HVAC companies is called the manual J method. I found a simplified version below but the real thing involved a whole book. https://www.indeed.com/career-advice/career-development/manu...

This page does the full Manual J, but it is challenging to do and understand. I used it to confirm the estimates that my installer did without a full J workup, and it was helpful.

https://loadcalc.net/

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#639

I've seen other construction related businesses try to go direct and it is extremely difficult. By going direct to the homeowner you are targeting the venn diagram union of "people who are willing & able to do the work themselves" and "people who will pay more" How are you going to build your service network? You say you will "connect them with a contractor to do the actual install." But contractors make their money…

> By going direct to the homeowner you are targeting the venn diagram union of "people who are willing & able to do the work themselves"

This is meant to be installed by a professional contractor, not the homeowner.

> How are you going to build your service network?

Compensate the contractors fairly and act as lead gen.

> Who are the decision makers in your target market exactly?

Homeowners. Not targeting multiunit residential or new builds, they care less about efficiency because they don't bear the cost of ownership.

> What? How could duct work possibly be incompatible with a heat pump?

A natural gas furnace requires ~150cfm airflow per 10kbtu heat produced, while a heat pump requires 330cfm per 10kbtu. This large mismatch in required airflow means that if you replace a natural gas furnace with a like sized heat pump, you've likely exceeded the ability of the air handler blower. Luckily most natural gas furnaces are grossly oversized for homes. The way you find the right size unit is with our software.

Re: Launch HN: Electric Air (YC W23) – Heat pump sold directly to homeowners

#640
I think you are going about this the wrong way.

If you want to build a better experience with converting fossil fuel or electric resistance systems to heat pumps then you want to put together a network of installers and standardize on widely available equipment from existing manufacturers.

If you want to design the next generation of heat pumps, then don’t sell directly to the consumer.

Your price so far is pretty outrageous, a Mr Cool unit is an order of magnitude cheaper for the same BTU. No it won’t monitor CO2 and air quality, etc. But at the prices you are asking it’s a major investment into a startup and these systems require support more than technology.

Lastly, your sales pitch is off. There are loads of heat pumps or there, from DIY installed units to multi ton full systems. If your main value proposition is the integration of air quality and humidity then explain why a whole house humidifier and a HEPA filter won’t be enough. Just explaining what a heat pump is isn’t going to cut it.

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