Remember folks fines are just written off as business expense. Unless people responsible are jailed long time this will just continue. What happens then ? Pay the fine and repeat cycle.
Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
141–150 of 190 posts
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#142Earlier quoted context omitted.
Probably. They did just lose a big court case. But if I ask "how old are you?" in an interview and reject anyone who says "17", then all the interviewees are going to say "18". Kids are pretty dumb but they can figure this stuff out. I'd be happy to claim 10 years of Kubernetes experience if I thought it would give me an advantage in the job market, no question. The children in question are already violating local la…
The age of the kids was in their system. So the children did not lie about their age. It’s weird to defend the company that knowingly illegally employs kids in hazardous job and instead doubt the govt agency that brings this problem to light. > The children in question are already violating local labour laws; No they aren’t. Their age was in company’s system and company ignored it. Also they are “children”. You expec…
> The age of the kids was in their system.
Oh, I missed that. I thought they meant that the company had ignored the investigators flagging that there were minors employed. Yeah that is pretty bad.
Although I maintain there are going to be a lot more than 100 children illegally employed as cleaners in the US. Not everyone is going to be stupid enough to keep good records like that.
> Software development is not a hazardous job
Adults shouldn't be at risk of being injured on a worksite. The standard is supposed to be no lasting damage regardless of whether children are involved or not.
The article mentions 3 injuries, but frankly I don't care if they are injuring 18 year olds or 13 year olds; the problem is the injury not which end of teenager-hood a person falls. That is an issue, but it is an issue that is unrelated to employing underage workers.
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#143Earlier quoted context omitted.
RealID was supposed to curtail this. They certainly made it hard enough for real citizens to get ID.
I don't know about Wisconsin, but in my state RealID is entirely optional. When you get a driver's license (or state ID/"Non-driver's license") you have the option to have your fingerprints taken to receive a RealID compliant ID, or not, in which case your ID is valid for only state purposes. I'm a natural-born US citizen, and I opted not to get a RealID-compliant state ID. I have no need for it. I use my driver's li…
Fingerprints aren't required for RealID. That's some nanny state BS your local government has added on. They aren't even needed for an Enhanced license for N.Am. border crossings.
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#144Earlier quoted context omitted.
These kids are not doing this to spend money on frivolous things like Fortnite. They are almost certainly migrant children who need the money because they’ve been placed with guardians who themselves are barely getting by or are exploiting the children by making them work off a debt. There was a massive nytimes expose on the issue which is driving the uptick in enforcement. https://www.nytimes.com/2023/02/25/us/unacc…
Yep. > They are almost certainly migrant children who need the money because they’ve been placed with guardians who themselves are barely getting by s/migrant/poor, but otherwise I 100% agree. Kids from poor families want to be able to help with money if they can. Their contributions do help, too, and I don't think that's a bad thing in most cases. Growing up poor, realizing your parents' financial situation, working…
> Growing up poor, realizing your parents' financial situation, working hard to contribute to it, and then busting your ass to build a live that's better than your parents..
The problem is, it perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Dropping out of school at age 16 or whatever to help your parents make rent by slaving away in a supermarket stocking shelves will stunt your intellectual and career growth for decades, because without an actual education (be it trades or academia) it will be really hard to access better-paying jobs.
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#145I used to do this sort of overnight cleaning but in medical. Based on my experience I would be very surprised if the overwhelming majority of these kids weren't a) immigrants and b) working the same shift least one of their parents. I wouldn't say it was typical to have teenagers around but when you saw one it almost always turned out that they carpool with a parent even if they didn't necessarily work in proximity t…
> I wouldn't say it was typical to have teenagers around but when you saw one it almost always turned out that they carpool with a parent even if they didn't necessarily work in proximity to each other.
Yep.
I'm not defending this at all, but there is context that may not be clear if you're not familiar with these communities.
At least with the teen working, the parent knows where they are and the family is gaining income. The alternative is likely the teen staying home unsupervised, which is neither providing opportunity for the child nor income for the family.
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#146Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#147Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of course Tyson knows. Cheaper labor directly translates to increased profits. If Tyson and other megacorporations don't encourage this practice, they are leaving money on the table and violating their fiduciary duty.
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Explaining transnational capitalism != justifying atrocities. The ease at which you jump to personal attacks is extremely concerning.
I obviously do not condone the actions of Tyson here.
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#148Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yep. > They are almost certainly migrant children who need the money because they’ve been placed with guardians who themselves are barely getting by s/migrant/poor, but otherwise I 100% agree. Kids from poor families want to be able to help with money if they can. Their contributions do help, too, and I don't think that's a bad thing in most cases. Growing up poor, realizing your parents' financial situation, working…
> Growing up poor, realizing your parents' financial situation, working hard to contribute to it, and then busting your ass to build a live that's better than your parents.. The problem is, it perpetuates the cycle of poverty. Dropping out of school at age 16 or whatever to help your parents make rent by slaving away in a supermarket stocking shelves will stunt your intellectual and career growth for decades, because…
> Dropping out of school at age 16 or whatever to help your parents make rent by slaving away in a supermarket stocking shelves will stunt your intellectual and career growth for decades, because without an actual education (be it trades or academia) it will be really hard to access better-paying jobs.
Compared to what we, the HN community, expects - yeah, I agree 100%.
Compared to what this community expects... it's not so clear.
We're making a lot of assumptions: that these children are dropping out of school, that the purpose of their working is to help feed their family, that they have better opportunities available to them, that the children and their parents want the same things as we do, etc.
The reality is that their parents likely never graduated high school either. There's no reason to think that these kids are choosing work over school, as opposed to doing both - which obviously would negatively impact their ability to succeed at school, but that's not the same thing as dropping out.
If these kids grow into adults who have graduated high school, they'll likely end up providing a more stable foundation for their children, so they can focus on school more than they were able to. They'll be more likely to push their kids to go to college, and to enter a field with higher qualification requirements like medicine, law, finance, or tech.
This is how immigrant communities have always worked, to the point that it's a stereotype. There's a reason second- and third-generation immigrants consistently outperform "native" groups in terms of both educational and professional attainment.
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#149Earlier quoted context omitted.
Of course Tyson knows. Cheaper labor directly translates to increased profits. If Tyson and other megacorporations don't encourage this practice, they are leaving money on the table and violating their fiduciary duty.
Their fiduciary duty is to violate the law to make money?
If that is what it takes, sure. As long as the punishment is less than the reward, it's good business.
Re: Over 100 kids illegally employed in hazardous jobs, contractor pays $1.5M fine
#150Earlier quoted context omitted.
Immigration is one of the areas that such blatant lying happens by partisans. We do have defacto open borders. A good segment of Dems politicians and activists try to cover this up. They also misrepresent temporary "humanitarian" visas as being temporary. They are never temporary and always get extended. On the other side is the lack of enforcement on the employer side which a good segment of Rs ignore. Cut off incen…
Approximately 2.7 million arrests have been made at the border since Biden became president. Of those, roughly two thirds were immediately removed from the US under Remain in Mexico/Title 42.[1] Many of the remainder were immediately taken into immigration detention, faced removal proceedings, and were themselves eventually removed from the country (as are many who were not initially arrested at the border).[2] It is…
They heard it on fox and repeat it as fact.