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Children’s IQ dropped during lockdown, study finds

telegraph.co.uk

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Re: Children’s IQ dropped during lockdown, study finds

#41
post #15
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not?

Because the scale itself shifts over time. For the sake of argument, let's say that IQ really does measure "intelligence". By the definition of the IQ scale, 100 is always whatever the average intelligence is. So the average intelligence of people in the 1960s was 100. Let's say people have become dumber (or smarter, doesn't matter) in the time since then -- the average IQ of people now is still 100. How much absolut…

You didn't answer my question. Above, you said that IQ tests cannot compare intelligence differences over time and I asked why. The fact that the average is always normalized to 100 doesn't make your statement true. Researchers can simply not normalize it to see the difference over time.

Re: Children’s IQ dropped during lockdown, study finds

#43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like what? What is a bad reason for not wanting the government to force you into house arrest?

At some point most covid-related conversations departed the realm of logic and turned into a sort of religious/political war, which also caused a bunch of people say things they didn't believe or care about just to score some points for themselves. My "favorite" one was that if, in 2020, you for one second doubted that it was some mysterious bats, some people automatically labelled you as a conspiracy theorist and po…

> Similarly, some people made a point to violate or otherwise shit on every single covid precaution not because of some firm scientific beliefs but just to piss people off and potentially score some PR points.

There's plenty of grifting on every side these days. Let's just ignore that.

But the core of the issue is a question about whether scientists have the right to settle political disputes about what we should do.

We argue that they do not. Science tries to tell us what is, but political will decides what ought to be done.

We argued that the government has no moral right to confine us to our homes, regardless of the circumstances. - this was a decision for individuals.

In our society, we treat scientists (or people who pose as scientists) as truth tellers ("trust the science") - an all-knowing priestly caste. However, this never was a scientific question. There's no science experiment that says the police should have harrassed people for sunbathing in the park. It was a political decision. We're not ruled by scientists - as we have seen, for very good reason.

Now of course, there are widespread problems in science: the reproducibility crisis, financial corruption, social bias, overselling speculative findings, overselling speculative models, mid-wit interpretations etc. - and for these reasons, a person who adopts a "non-scientific" frame often has superior predictive and interpretive powers to someone who "trusts the science". This is why the "conspiracy theorists" keep getting proven right over and over.

The lab leak theory was always extremely credible, but it was dismissed because it was a way to own the "basket of deplorables", and because it called into question the competance of the medical establishment.

Re: Children’s IQ dropped during lockdown, study finds

#44
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the main opposition to Labour should be dismissed off hand? The conflation of 'the political left's perception of reality' with 'the truth' is outrageous, and nothing more than an attempt to delegitimize views that conflict with the political left's agenda, which corresponds with polls showing in the US, registered Democrats are increasingly gravitating toward authoritarianism: https://rumble.com/vnwyhz-the-mounta…

Criticising the Telegraph has nothing to do with dismissing the opposition to the Labour party. If anybody’s IQ dropped significantly after 2012, it is the target readership of this paper, that went from being a respectable newspaper to a news outlet peddling anti-immigrant, anti-eu and, more recently, anti-lockdown rhetoric. It has become a Daily Mail with slightly less idiotic headlines and more conventional graphi…

>>Criticising the Telegraph has nothing to do with dismissing the opposition to the Labour party.

The OP specifically mentioned being pro-Tory

"a mouth piece for Tory anti-lockdown "reporters"

And the fact that you also list a number of Tory positions that they support, including the opposition to lockdowns, as if it's self-evident that holding those positions disqualifies them as a respectable source, is exactly what I'm talking about.

Re: Children’s IQ dropped during lockdown, study finds

#45
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Criticising the Telegraph has nothing to do with dismissing the opposition to the Labour party. If anybody’s IQ dropped significantly after 2012, it is the target readership of this paper, that went from being a respectable newspaper to a news outlet peddling anti-immigrant, anti-eu and, more recently, anti-lockdown rhetoric. It has become a Daily Mail with slightly less idiotic headlines and more conventional graphi…

>>Criticising the Telegraph has nothing to do with dismissing the opposition to the Labour party. The OP specifically mentioned being pro-Tory "a mouth piece for Tory anti-lockdown "reporters" And the fact that you also list a number of Tory positions that they support, including the opposition to lockdowns, as if it's self-evident that holding those positions disqualifies them as a respectable source, is exactly wha…

It is true that they are a mouth piece for the Tory party, particularly for Boris Johnson. It is also true that they are not a respectable source since at least 2014, when they started publishing idiocies such as:

- https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/11599609...

- https://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/thinking-man/mayday-i-have-a...

- https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/02/watch-eu-vaccine...

- https://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/life/brexiteers-can-now-sh...

Finally, it is also a fact that they are currently a mounth piece for anti-lockdown "reporters". We put that in quotes because (1) none of them would be able to understand any of the random papers they cherrypick and (2) they actively contributed to Johnson's electoral campaign in 2019, knowing that he would make a mess (as he did with lockdowns and covid management).

Re: Children’s IQ dropped during lockdown, study finds

#46
post #41
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because the scale itself shifts over time. For the sake of argument, let's say that IQ really does measure "intelligence". By the definition of the IQ scale, 100 is always whatever the average intelligence is. So the average intelligence of people in the 1960s was 100. Let's say people have become dumber (or smarter, doesn't matter) in the time since then -- the average IQ of people now is still 100. How much absolut…

You didn't answer my question. Above, you said that IQ tests cannot compare intelligence differences over time and I asked why. The fact that the average is always normalized to 100 doesn't make your statement true. Researchers can simply not normalize it to see the difference over time.

I did answer your question.

There's a good reason that IQ works the way it does -- it's because IQ tests are affected by lots of things other than intelligence, and those things are not constant over time. How well you do on an IQ test is affected by societal factors, for instance.

This goes back to why I said that IQ tests are a poor proxy for intelligence at best. IQ test do not measure intelligence (there's not even any consensus on what "intelligence" actually is, and if you don't know what it is, it's pretty hard to measure). IQ tests measure competency in things that roughly orbit intelligence, but are also influenced by your cultural upbringing, your socioeconomic status, and even strange things like what type of thinking (not how good it is) your brain happens to engage in.

The one thing that IQ seems to correlate well to is how well you'll do in college. But even there, the correlation is pretty loose.

Re: Children’s IQ dropped during lockdown, study finds

#47
post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Criticising the Telegraph has nothing to do with dismissing the opposition to the Labour party. The OP specifically mentioned being pro-Tory "a mouth piece for Tory anti-lockdown "reporters" And the fact that you also list a number of Tory positions that they support, including the opposition to lockdowns, as if it's self-evident that holding those positions disqualifies them as a respectable source, is exactly wha…

It is true that they are a mouth piece for the Tory party, particularly for Boris Johnson. It is also true that they are not a respectable source since at least 2014, when they started publishing idiocies such as: - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/11599609... - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/thinking-man/mayday-i-have-a... - https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2021/03/02/watch-eu-vaccine... - https:…

None of that addresses my point, which is that implicit in your argument is the premise that being pro-Tory, or supporting Tory positions like opposing lockdowns, makes one not respectable.
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