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Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

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Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#161

I see a lot of unexpected saltiness and clear misconceptions in any thread about SVB. “Depositors shouldn’t get anything beyond the insured $250,000”. Then what do we do with the billions in remaining assets? Appropriate them, and leave small and mid businesses hanged to dry? “This is a bailout”. It would be if shareholders were to get their money back, which doesn’t seem likely. The government will use the bank asse…

Literally not a single person is suggesting not using the banks existing assets to make depositors true.

what we are saying is this should ONLY use the assets SVB has. Nothing more.

I’m not sure why y’all keep making a strawman to fight this.

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#162

I see a lot of unexpected saltiness and clear misconceptions in any thread about SVB. “Depositors shouldn’t get anything beyond the insured $250,000”. Then what do we do with the billions in remaining assets? Appropriate them, and leave small and mid businesses hanged to dry? “This is a bailout”. It would be if shareholders were to get their money back, which doesn’t seem likely. The government will use the bank asse…

> Generic screeching against the tech world

There's some of this, for sure. But there's an equivalent screeching from the tech finance world[1] demanding a full government guarantee. That ain't happening, and I think it's appropriate for the fed to make that clear.

FWIW: the dirty secret here is likely that there's a bunch of internal dealing going on as regards SVB. They were The Startup Bank for some reason, it's not random. And my guess is that we'll discover that a whole lot of big venture players turn out to be extremely exposed[2] to an SVB failure. A lot of VCs are probably losing their shirts here.

[1] Jason Calacanis's caps lock has been stuck down since Friday.

[2] Or worse. Genuine fraud has turned up in previous FDIC seizures. But no evidence exists right now.

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did they help depositors that lost money in the last 500+ bank collapses? Why do they get special treatment? The government has laws and rules the depositors are insured up to 250k. Either they liquidate and everyone takes a hair cut. Or they wait till the bonds mature and can pay them out. But the government should not relieve anyone past what is legally available.

I’m inclined to agree, this kind of special treatment is fairly ridiculous, depositors in other bank failures with funds over FDIC limits have to wait for fire sales to recover, which can take years in some cases. I’m not sure exactly what Yellen is proposing (I only subscribe to print FT so no access), but it seems like special treatment for the well connected on Sandhill Road.

The response to this crisis has been very telling. No one I meet wants Big Tech to be saved or has any good response when asked about Silicon Valley. The response is one we would expect for a group of people that have enslaved us rather than liberated us. Made us miserable rather than delighted.

I see two waves in Silicon Valley. Wave one was actual innovation, computers etc. Wave two was rent-seeking conmen fueled by zero interest rates and privacy thieves.

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#164

I see a lot of unexpected saltiness and clear misconceptions in any thread about SVB. “Depositors shouldn’t get anything beyond the insured $250,000”. Then what do we do with the billions in remaining assets? Appropriate them, and leave small and mid businesses hanged to dry? “This is a bailout”. It would be if shareholders were to get their money back, which doesn’t seem likely. The government will use the bank asse…

The reason is because there are countless scenarios in the US economic system, where people/businesses fail cause of no fault of their own, but they are told tough luck that's the free market at work cause these people are simply unconnected or their failure is deemed unimportant. It's why the finanical bailouts left a bitter taste for anyone paying attention, and why gov't action here is immediately scoffed at.

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#165
Does anyone have any hard numbers on the risk of potential contagion in the banking sector? This is a rather large institution to go bust, and there is some discussion that a large percentage of their portfolio is composed of members that are over the FDIC limit. I also don't know how the Treasury mismatch can be solved - do you just tell creditors to wait for the maturity of the 10 year bonds to withdraw their funds and eat inflation when moving the assets to the Santa Clara bank? Ideally, if there is no risk of contagion to the larger financial system all of these firms can take a hike, but I don't know if that's known a priori. Yellen is just saying "we're not going to do that," but it would be helpful if there were some hard numbers or other reassurance that they know that the larger economy won't be affected (outside of these firms going bust for poor asset management).

EDIT -

From the WSJ (https://archive.ph/HZ29y)

"

A plan that soothes nerves about access to uninsured deposits—most of the bank’s deposits are sizable enough that they don’t carry Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. protection—could tamp down the crisis and limit any impact on the economy as the Federal Reserve focuses on combating inflation by raising interest rates.

But failing to swiftly clarify how SVB’s customers can access funds, make payroll and conduct business risks broader economic consequences and threatens to complicate the Fed’s monetary policy decisions.

“We want to make sure that the troubles that exist at one bank don’t create contagion to others that are sound,” Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen said in an interview on Face the Nation on CBS Sunday. “We are concerned about depositors and are focused on trying to meet their needs.”

Ms. Yellen declined to provide details on what federal policymakers are considering.

"

In other words, it doesn't look like we know anything yet.

This is the statement from the Financial Times article -

“Let me be clear that during the financial crisis, there were investors and owners of systemic large banks that were bailed out . . . and the reforms that have been put in place means we are not going to do that again,” Yellen said. “But we are concerned about depositors, and we’re focused on trying to meet their needs.”

And from here - https://www.fastcompany.com/90864111/silicon-valley-bank-svb...

"

The FDIC ordered the closure of Silicon Valley Bank and immediately took position (sic - possession) of all deposits at the bank Friday. The bank had $209 billion in assets and $175.4 billion in deposits at the time of failure, the FDIC said in a statement. It was unclear how much of deposits was above the $250,000 insurance limit at the moment.

"

Unless SVB had over 700,000 customers, quite clearly there is a mismatch between insured and uninsured customers.

So by Yellen saying “But we are concerned about depositors, and we’re focused on trying to meet their needs.” and at the same time saying there won't be a bailout she's effectively saying nothing. In this case those things are synonymous.

Until there are hard numbers on possible contagion and the steps that the Federal government is going to take to prevent that we won't know anything for sure.

FYI - Here's the transcript of the interview with Janet Yellen on Face the Nation - https://www.cbsnews.com/news/janet-yellen-face-the-nation-tr...

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#166

I see a lot of unexpected saltiness and clear misconceptions in any thread about SVB. “Depositors shouldn’t get anything beyond the insured $250,000”. Then what do we do with the billions in remaining assets? Appropriate them, and leave small and mid businesses hanged to dry? “This is a bailout”. It would be if shareholders were to get their money back, which doesn’t seem likely. The government will use the bank asse…

This whole saga has exposed the shocking financial illiteracy in this industry. There are laws and procedures about how to handle the situation. Banks fail all the time and the FDIC disposes of them all the time.

Depositors will get their insured money on monday. The FDIC will then dispose of all the banks assets and return the proceeds to its creditors, that is depositors.

Calling for the government to guarantee all deposits unconditionally is exactly calling for a bailout. Calling for the government to follow it's own laws and procedures as usual is redundant.

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#167
post #24

Says nothing real. For instance, will the rule for uninsured deposits be followed ? Or will there be a bailout for people with over $250,000 in deposits ? Seems all it says is "there will be no bailout but there will be a bailout". If people with over 250,000 in deposits are covered, the once again the the rich is allowed to avoid all risks for bad decisions.

> If people with over 250,000 in deposits are covered, the once again the the rich is allowed to avoid all risks for bad decisions. I feel like putting your money in a bank should not be considered an obviously bad decision. The risk profile your bank takes on with your deposits is largely opaque to you, and it’s not feasible to expect every depositor to do due diligence on it. Even if you understood their portfolio…

If you can have more than 250,000 in a bank account, you are rich. You should know and accept the risks you are taking. If you do not like the FDIC insurance laws, get it changed.

In 2008, people lost their houses and many their savings because they were not rich. And these people were not bailed out even though it was due to issues they had no control over. Most of these losses were a lot less than that 250,000 you have. But you are saying "because I have 250,000 I deserve a bailout, screw the people who are not rich because that is their fault."

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#168
post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the downvoters... "International Monetary Fund - What Is a Bank?" - https://www.imf.org/external/pubs/ft/fandd/2012/03/basics.ht... ".... Banks are intermediaries between depositors (who lend money to the bank) and borrowers (to whom the bank lends money)..."

Your citation for why they aren't depositors refers to them as depositors. I'm confused.

And your confusion is completely normal. An insidious action expressly used by the interested, in manipulating language for it's purposes. It has already been nicely addressed by Weinberg in his books.

That is why every dry desert urban development in the middle of nowhere, with hardly any water for hundreds of miles, is called... Watery Creek...That is why employees are sometimes called business partners, that is why private investments funds are in some countries called pensions, and finally the reason why creditors at banks are called depositors. To delude you into making you believe, you are or have more, than what you really are, or might have.

"The Secrets of Consulting" - https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/secrets-consulting-guide-givi...

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#169
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yellen is suggesting they will, but there’s no details yet. I don’t believe the FDIC has the legal authority to do so, but it’s highly possible that the treasury and/or Federal Reserve can cobble together some ad hoc legal justification.

There’s a lot of ways they can just do whatever they want. It could be as simple as the fed purchasing a large long dated convertible note with very favorable terms from the new entity created for receivership and then turning around and selling that entity to another bank, now that the balance sheet is fine. Or the conceptual equivalent.

[deleted]

Re: Yellen says government will help SVB depositors but rules out bailout

#170

I see a lot of unexpected saltiness and clear misconceptions in any thread about SVB. “Depositors shouldn’t get anything beyond the insured $250,000”. Then what do we do with the billions in remaining assets? Appropriate them, and leave small and mid businesses hanged to dry? “This is a bailout”. It would be if shareholders were to get their money back, which doesn’t seem likely. The government will use the bank asse…

can’t people buy private insurance for their deposits above the $250k threshold?

if you buy an expensive house or car you generally pay a lot more to insure that asset. not sure why people don’t think of buying insurance on their bank deposits in the same way if you find yourself in a situation where you need to hold much more than $250k in one account for whatever reason.

But even if you’re an individual holding million in cash (and for whatever reason it is not invested), it isn’t exactly difficult to open 10 checking + savings accounts and putting $250k each. In fact that is the prudent thing to do.

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