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Growing crops under solar panels

fastcompany.com

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Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#121

Post by hulitu »

ctz wrote: post #116
xyzzyz wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And if France makes it mandatory to cover all "substantial" parking lots it will generate as much electricity from just that as 10 nuclear power plants [1]. It will not, not even close to that. You are being deceived. This deception is willful, because it is obvious to anyone who has any idea about realities of energy generation. The linked article, however, while not literally lying, omits some obvious facts, the…

That's an awful lot of vitriolic words to express: comparing kW and kWp is a type error. > This is caused by the unfortunate fact which is that the sun doesn't shine at all for at least half of the year And factually incorrect. Currently sitting in Northern Europe making 5.05kW from a 5.6kWp installation.

... Currently. And average ?

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#122

Post by mikro2nd »

detourdog wrote: post #109
mikro2nd wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pastures used for grazing are managed intensively using big machines. (Source: I live next door to a large dairy farm. Pastures irrigated with centre-pivot systems.) Pastures get replanted/supplemental sowing every so often, weeds get sprayed with herbicides, fields get mowed to maintain uniform growth after they've been grazed...

Pastures requiring machinery is the exception not the rule. I can’t figure out what your neighbor is doing.

Factory-farming dairy. Nothing at all unusual. If you have some bucolic vision of cows peacefully grazing all day, being led to a milking shed twice a day, flies buzzing in the sunshine... disabuse yourself of the illusion. When people say "factory-farming" they mean something far closer to "factory" than "farm". To keep cows at maximum productivity, dairy farmers (others farmers, too, I'm certain!) are squeezing the maximum productivity out of their pastures, and that means working them intensively; constant management = plenty of machinery.

I can't for the life of me imagine how these operations are going to continue to produce at these levels without the fossil-fuel subsidy they depend on completely.

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#123

Post by detourdog »

lovemenot wrote: post #45
mminer237 wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am a farmer, and this doesn't make sense. Grazing fields aren't really growing crops. Even if this is just crops that are picked by hand (it mentions broccoli), they typically still have huge machines follow the laborers for them to deposit them in: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKyxMKO2kyU I can't see any good way to harvest a field with solar panels that isn't so inefficiently laid out that it would be better t…

I am not a farmer, but am interested in watching the development of agricultural tech. >> I can't see any good way to harvest a field with solar panels that isn't so inefficiently laid out that it would be better to have two separate fields. Would there be scope for smaller autonomous machines? Presumably, there should be some crop configurations that could benefit, but we don't yet have all the results of experiment…

Yes a Beowolf cluster could definitely harvest crops.

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#124

Post by detourdog »

mikro2nd wrote: post #122
detourdog wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pastures requiring machinery is the exception not the rule. I can’t figure out what your neighbor is doing.

Factory-farming dairy. Nothing at all unusual. If you have some bucolic vision of cows peacefully grazing all day, being led to a milking shed twice a day, flies buzzing in the sunshine... disabuse yourself of the illusion. When people say "factory-farming" they mean something far closer to "factory" than "farm". To keep cows at maximum productivity, dairy farmers (others farmers, too, I'm certain!) are squeezing the…

I grew up in Pennsylvania Dutch country so rich with cows that Milton Hershey located his chocolate company nearby. I grew up on over 100 acres of that same farmland doing farming things. My Dad in Florida used was a member of the National Cattle Man's Association. I feel grounded in views of farming and acknowledge that my experience has nothing to do with factory farms. Frankly I'm a little embarrassed by the brain power exerted on this thread. I have been a member of both Future Farmers of America, and 4-H.

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#125

Post by fbdab103 »

defrost wrote: post #75
fbdab103 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why did the sheep not already have access to a shed or other form of shelter from the sun/rain?

There are some 68 million+ sheep in Australia and the barely 25 million people are facing a housing shortage ATM .. there's never been sheds and houses for sheep in Australia aside from shearing sheds that only see once per annum usage. As you can see here [1-4] paddocks have trees, dams, etc. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fi4FvVqMnBk [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y5RIqsac2Hs [3] https://www.youtube.com/w…

I had been assuming that even if there was not a shed, there would be ample trees for the animals to take shelter when needed. Wild to me that providing shade had been neglected by the shepherd.

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#126

Post by dylan604 »

cyberax wrote: post #106
dylan604 wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

shoot, around my parts of Texas, when you stand in the shade of a tree, the tree looks at you and says, "trust me, it's not any cooler here"

You have trees?!?

well, they are Mesquite bushes, but it's got leaves, grows from the ground, produces wood, and makes a bit of shade, therefore...tree.

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#127

Post by thethethethe »

the8472 wrote: post #118
thethethethe wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would we destroy pristine desert, which is rapidly disappearing, when we could cover land that has already been disturbed, like parking lots, building roofs, and farmland? Deserts are important ecosystems regardless of their immediate utility to industrial society

> Deserts are important ecosystem Are you using "important" to say "have a function beyond being inert matter"? Then sure, but that information is already conveyed by saying "it's an ecosystem", adding that kind of "important" doesn't add information. If you mean "rank above many other things in a similar category" then I'm skeptical. The first one isn't helpful in this context because we need to put PV somewhere, we…

> The first one isn't helpful in this context because we need to put PV somewhere, we might as well look for a place of less relative importance.

Yes, like the places I mentioned in my comment

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#128

Post by thethethethe »

eru wrote: post #58
thethethethe wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would we destroy pristine desert, which is rapidly disappearing, when we could cover land that has already been disturbed, like parking lots, building roofs, and farmland? Deserts are important ecosystems regardless of their immediate utility to industrial society

Deserts are rapidly disappearing?

Pristine deserts are. Invasive species, drought, and human development are all damaging desert ecosystems, which take much longer to recover than less arid biomes.

Just because deserts appear barren doesn't mean there isn't an ecosystem there that isn't important.

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#129

Post by ed25519FUUU »

lovemenot wrote: post #48
ed25519FUUU wrote: post #37

This is a very CA-centric research topic. In most of the US heartland theres millions and millions and millions of acres of farmland. There’s no need and limited benefit to mixing PV with agriculture. And the places where it does make sense it makes sense only for running goats around in the PV sites to keep weeds down.

That's a very USA-centric comment. To the best of my knowledge, the two countries doing most research on agrivoltaics are Japan and China.

The countries that develop, build, and sell solar panels? Not surprising.

Re: Growing crops under solar panels

#130

Post by thethethethe »

throwaway742 wrote: post #71
thethethethe wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would we destroy pristine desert, which is rapidly disappearing, when we could cover land that has already been disturbed, like parking lots, building roofs, and farmland? Deserts are important ecosystems regardless of their immediate utility to industrial society

I agree that protecting desert ecosystems is important, but isn't desertification more of a problem than "rapidly disappearing" desert?

desertification is the destruction of arable land, not the expansion of healthy desert ecosystems. Healthy desert ecosystems are disappearing, not expanding
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