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Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

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Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#51

Post by nextaccountic »

flir wrote: post #15
nextaccountic wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately it doesn't make sense to use us as batteries or energy sources, thermodynamically. But they could maybe use our brains as computers (and this was the first idea the writers had, they just decided against it because it would be too complicated for mainstream audiences) But in this case it would be rather wasteful to also nourish the rest of the body. As a bonus, if all the remaining people are just brain…

In that film (brains in a jar), you don't escape to reality, you escape to a different level of the matrix (one where you've got superpowers). Last shot in the film will have a lot in common with the last shot in Terry Gilliam's Brazil. It won't get great results from test audiences.

> Last shot in the film

What do you mean by that? (Not a native speaker and out of ideas on how to search for it)

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#52

Post by aporetics »

scatters wrote: post #50
abricq wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This concerns me and saddens me a lot. Major changes are required in the near future, and the more I look at the news the less it seems like any of these changes are happening. If at some point I actually get to the conclusion that "it's all bullshit" (i.e. climate change is all bullshit) to those in charge of making these changes, then I have to see how to change those in charge. But really, the options are limited.…

> the more I look at the news the less it seems like any of these changes are happening What news are you reading? Last year the world invested $500bn in wind and solar, and another $500bn in energy efficiency. The IRA has $369bn for green tech, and Europe is going to spend $270bn. The invasion of Ukraine has left large amounts of Russian oil and gas effectively stranded. We're going to reach peak carbon in 5 years,…

Does it matter if by then we’ve fractured or cut down what’s left of the world’s forests? Deforestation the last decade https://ourworldindata.org/deforestation

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#53

Post by woopsn »

ketanmaheshwari wrote: post #3

The article says that tree roots released massive nutrients into the oceans during the period of decay causing algae bloom depleting the Oxygen and triggering the extinction. Why just the roots and not the entire trees? Wouldn't the entire tree be decayed and end up in the ocean?

There was no soil yet at this time. Plants rooted directly into rock, turning the surface into gravel/sediment, weathering and runoff carried minerals and carbon away into the water. The landscape's stability depends on the roots, and so during mass extinction events, minerals and carbon get dumped en masse from the continents into the sea, and atmospheric CO2 levels drop because of weathering.

That part is relatively well established. This paper looks at the transport of phosphorus in particular, from terrestrial rock into marine ecosystems.

Plants can't take up phosphorus in its mineral bound form. Modern trees have micro-organisms living on their roots that release P (and N etc) from the soil. In certain periods of the Devonian era, P would have been primarily liberated from the rock by acids let off by the plant roots as they decayed.

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#54

Post by user3939382 »

jvm___ wrote: post #28
user3939382 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (United Nations Climate Change conference) will be held by United Arab Emirates's minister for industry and CEO of the Abu Dhabi National Oil https://unwatch.org/u-n-elects-saudi-arabia-to-womens-rights... A lot of regulatory bodies, commissions, councils, are for optics and captured by the governments or corporations they should be regulating in some way. Put another way we have the fox watching the hen house. Put…

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulatory_capture I mean, if the sidewalks outside your house were government controlled, the most likely people to try to take control of them would be people with an interest in making money from them (somehow). Most people don't enter government to be the "Minister of Forestry" without some previous industry experience, and a plan of what to do with the forests. The people with indus…

> The people with industry experience

This is at the heart of the problem. You get these revolving doors between eg big positions at the FDA and big pharma staffed by the same individuals at different times in their careers, same with eg Wall St vs SEC. This extends to lobby group positions. One day Fred is the head of the FDA the next day he’s lobbying the FDA for Pfizer. This should be illegal.

They mask the corruption this causes by saying “Hey we need someone with industry/regulatory experience” with no acknowledgement of the massive ($$) conflicts of interest inherent in that strategy.

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#55

Post by flir »

nextaccountic wrote: post #51
flir wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In that film (brains in a jar), you don't escape to reality, you escape to a different level of the matrix (one where you've got superpowers). Last shot in the film will have a lot in common with the last shot in Terry Gilliam's Brazil. It won't get great results from test audiences.

> Last shot in the film What do you mean by that? (Not a native speaker and out of ideas on how to search for it)

Literally? I'm talking about the last scene in the film, right at the end. The last thing that happens before the credits.

The film's nearly 40, and I still don't want to spolier it. Suffice to say, it made me feel physically sick.

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#56

Post by pvaldes »

FrojoS wrote: post #41
pvaldes wrote: post #36

> others have made the argument that pollution from fertilizers, manure and other organic wastes, such as sewage, have placed the Earth’s oceans on the “edge of anoxia,” or a complete lack of oxygen. This is nonsense, obviously. Would apply only for shallow bottom or fresh waters

Can you explain further, please? I don't doubt what you are saying, but don't know why it is "obvious". Is it, because the amount of sea water is so large, relative to the amount of 'pollution'? The abstract of the paper linked in the article seems to support your statement, though. "For the past several hundred million years, oxygen concentrations in Earth's atmosphere have been comparatively high[..]. Yet, the ocea…

Is a complex theme

To start anoxia is a relative term. It depends on how much oxygen do you spent respect to how fast you replace it. Is also a buffered event, and the problem corrects itself automatically [1]. Therefore, things like "the edge of anoxia" have moving boundaries and are difficult to define

[1] When some area is lacking oxygen, marine life response migrating or is simply killed. The result is that more oxygen is available for the rest until reaching a new equilibrium.

The article provided is paywalled, so I can't really evaluate it here

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#57

Post by taneq »

abricq wrote: post #20
taneq wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In what way is it not a "Don't Look Up" moment? It absolutely resonates with the theme of that documentary.

Yes that's what I meant, it could be taken from it. But it's not taken from the movie, it's actually happening (that's what I meant)

Ahh right, I read it as “a moment in the style of Don’t Look Up” (which it totally is) rather than “literally a thing in the movie” (which… yeah I agree.)

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#58

Post by firstlink »

user3939382 wrote: post #54
jvm___ wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulatory_capture I mean, if the sidewalks outside your house were government controlled, the most likely people to try to take control of them would be people with an interest in making money from them (somehow). Most people don't enter government to be the "Minister of Forestry" without some previous industry experience, and a plan of what to do with the forests. The people with indus…

> The people with industry experience This is at the heart of the problem. You get these revolving doors between eg big positions at the FDA and big pharma staffed by the same individuals at different times in their careers, same with eg Wall St vs SEC. This extends to lobby group positions. One day Fred is the head of the FDA the next day he’s lobbying the FDA for Pfizer. This should be illegal. They mask the corrup…

What you're suggesting is that a political preference to put the experts in positions of power is actually bad?

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#59

Post by justinclift »

firstlink wrote: post #58
user3939382 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The people with industry experience This is at the heart of the problem. You get these revolving doors between eg big positions at the FDA and big pharma staffed by the same individuals at different times in their careers, same with eg Wall St vs SEC. This extends to lobby group positions. One day Fred is the head of the FDA the next day he’s lobbying the FDA for Pfizer. This should be illegal. They mask the corrup…

What you're suggesting is that a political preference to put the experts in positions of power is actually bad?

Perhaps there's a difference between experts and lobbyists?

Re: Evolution of tree roots may have driven mass extinctions (2022)

#60

Post by nextaccountic »

flir wrote: post #55
nextaccountic wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Last shot in the film What do you mean by that? (Not a native speaker and out of ideas on how to search for it)

Literally? I'm talking about the last scene in the film, right at the end. The last thing that happens before the credits. The film's nearly 40, and I still don't want to spolier it. Suffice to say, it made me feel physically sick.

Oh, thanks!
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