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Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

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Re: Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

#11

Post by kennyfrc »

Marketer here. If I were to define the fundamental aspects of marketing, it would be as follows (I also have a note about feedback loops after):

1. Customer empathy: you need to know their pains, dreams, opinions, frustrations, and more. The first step of marketing is to always meet people where they are the most frustrated. Good resources for this are Amy Hoy’s Sales Safari [1], or Netnography [2]. I also like Sean D’Souzas Brain Audit [3]. Sean’s is the most accessible.

2. Copywriting: Once you can empathize with the persona / customer, you’ll need to learn how to relate your product or service to the person’s problems, needs, or dreams. There are many scammy resources out there, but the person who does his marketing in the most ethical way is again Sean D’souza [4]. Robert Bly is also good [5].

3. Distribution: once you solve for customer empathy and the right positioning (through compelling copywriting), the final step is to distribute your copies in various media. Weinberg’s Traction is a good starting point [6].

Some will recommend Russell Brunson, Sam Ovens, Gary Halbert, etc, but these folks are in the extreme end of marketing, and may not suit everyone. Their methods work for “get rich quick” online courses or coaching programs, but not for real products or services where you need to sustain a brand over time. The resources I mentioned are a good foundation for ethical marketing.

RE: Feedback loops - the fastest way to get a feedback loop is to start with content marketing. Your article must solve a tiny problem, then you distribute it. If you get good feedback, then make a longer article, then get feedback again. Then turn it into an ebook or small online tool, then get feedback. Keep increasing the size of your solution until you get to your desired goal (like a SaaS).

Another way to get a feedback loop is through ads: run multiple ads, compare their conversion rates, drop the worst ones, scale the best ones, then add more ad tests.

[1] https://stackingthebricks.com/video-sales-safari-in-action/

[2] https://www.amazon.com/Netnography-Essential-Qualitative-Soc...

[3] https://www.psychotactics.com/products/the-brain-audit-32-ma...

[4] https://www.psychotactics.com/home-study/copywriting-home-st...

[5] https://www.amazon.com/Copywriters-Handbook-Step-Step-Writin...

[6] https://www.amazon.com/Traction-Startup-Achieve-Explosive-Cu...

Re: Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

#12

Post by AlexITC »

I'm also learning about marketing and while I can't comment on that, I can share an alternative.

I have been trying to do "marketing as engineer" (not sure where I read the term). In short, let's make cool engineering stuff where you can place your own ads.

For example, I was able to get one of my toy projects at the hn frontpage, I have been speaking at some tech events where I could have mentioned my project.

Related to the product I'm working on, it took me a considerable time but I think I finally figured out a nice strategy to do marketing as engineer (I have high hopes but we'll see how it goes).

Overall, I feel this is considerably more engaging than doing traditional marketing.

Re: Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

#14

Post by julianeon »

You could specialize in SEO which feels like coding in that it's very analytical (simplified example: write 5 blog posts, check Google Search Console for how they're performing, write 5 more that should now do better based on what you've learned, etc.)

Re: Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

#16

Post by magundu »

AlexITC wrote: post #12

I'm also learning about marketing and while I can't comment on that, I can share an alternative. I have been trying to do "marketing as engineer" (not sure where I read the term). In short, let's make cool engineering stuff where you can place your own ads. For example, I was able to get one of my toy projects at the hn frontpage, I have been speaking at some tech events where I could have mentioned my project. Relat…

Yes, building free tools related to your product and promote your product inside that tools will be more effective.

Re: Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

#17

Post by alistairjallan »

Marketing Veteran here.

To give you direction I’d like to understand the purpose. If you’re familiar with software engineering you can draw a parallel between vastly different approaches eg FPGA programming vs native app development.

Are you looking to understand strategic (brand/integrated) approach to marketing or tactical (eg performance marketing)? Are you interested in understanding marketing to help specific objectives or to assist a business at different stages? (Aided Awareness or conversions). Are you interested in targeting consumers or businesses.

Let me know and I can provide some directional guidance.

Re: Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

#18

Post by nitwit005 »

First you put the crab costume on, and then you wave the sign with the name of the all you can eat seafood place. Simple really.

Or rather, you probably need to say which form of marketing you want to do. Any form of promoting a business can be considered marketing.

Re: Ask HN How do I learn marketing?

#19

Post by quickthrower2 »

mdcrowcroft wrote: post #9

I think one big difference between learning marketing vs learning software engineering is the lack of a feedback loop when you start out. If you want to learn marketing properly, it's worth thinking of marketing tactics and marketing strategy as two different things. - Marketing tactics are things like, running ads, writing content for SEO. Comparable to writing code day to day. - Marketing strategy is the high level…

Thanks for the recommendation. Reading the preview it does seem to assume marketing jargon knowledge, as if you are already a marketer.
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