Live data from Hacker News

React is holding me hostage

emnudge.dev

11–20 of 553 posts

Re: React is holding me hostage

#11
post #9
post #2

"frontend engineers"

same as "backend engineers", "database engineers" or "ai engineers" or "data scientists" we are all just primates staring at blinking lights and poking things

Yep! I’m full stack and have no clue why some people want to say frontend engineering is “less than” backend. It’s all a means to an end. The product requires both sides equally in most cases, and neither side is trivial.

Re: React is holding me hostage

#14
post #8

10 years with an unchanged react state model: https://reagent-project.github.io/

Having used reagent, watching the React space evolve is like a bricklayer watching a constant stream of innovations around mud. Sure, you could build foundations with bricks, but why do that when you can use a fancy mold and pour mud into it? Why have clean blocks when you can have sticky, messy, dirty goop?

Alas, castles and fortresses have been built with messy goop, and the amount of goop-specific tools and goop slappers far outweigh the bricklayers. So I too slap goop.

Re: React is holding me hostage

#15
post #8

10 years with an unchanged react state model: https://reagent-project.github.io/

Having used reagent, watching the React space evolve is like a bricklayer watching a constant stream of innovations around mud. Sure, you could build foundations with bricks, but why do that when you can use a fancy mold and pour mud into it? Why have clean blocks when you can have sticky, messy, dirty goop? Alas, castles and fortresses have been built with messy goop, and the amount of goop-specific tools and goop s…

metaphor of the year!

Re: React is holding me hostage

#17
post #3

The post is excellent (and I actually got quoted in there from my "Rendering Behavior" article), but the title seems completely over-editorialized? There's not even a mention of the word "fractal" in the post.

I take fractal to mean: at all scales

It was likely a play on the ancient https://eev.ee/blog/2012/04/09/php-a-fractal-of-bad-design/

Re: React is holding me hostage

#18
post #4

It's exciting & unsurprising to me that state is such an unsolved problem. For the longest time React was kind of in denial to a large degree about what they were. They called themselves a View library. Hooks have definitely noticeably changed that relationship, & how people integrate app state with React, but the problem here of updating hasn't really changed all that much. It's not a new thing either. A lot of the…

There is context which wages a war against debugging and testing, for one thing. React has no real answer to state going sideways. Then there is controlled/uncontrolled component which is an example of structural instability (what looks like a tiny change to your boss is a bigger deal than it should be) unless you ride the crazy train and use “plain ordinary javascript” to build a parallel system to move (some of) th…

You can often use route params or location hash for communicating state sideways if shared context is overkill, with the benefit of making the state bookmarkable or accessible in the history.

Re: React is holding me hostage

#20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is context which wages a war against debugging and testing, for one thing. React has no real answer to state going sideways. Then there is controlled/uncontrolled component which is an example of structural instability (what looks like a tiny change to your boss is a bigger deal than it should be) unless you ride the crazy train and use “plain ordinary javascript” to build a parallel system to move (some of) th…

You can often use route params or location hash for communicating state sideways if shared context is overkill, with the benefit of making the state bookmarkable or accessible in the history.

That's only sustainable for small pieces of state or some mechanism to exchange that small piece of state for a more complete piece of state.
Post reply on HN