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Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

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Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#21
Note: please read this all the way through before down/up voting. I'm not defending any actors here, I'm just trying to present an "all sides considered" view of the situation.

I think there's a fair amount of "projecting" going on here. More and more, I see the intellectual property discussion being couched in the language of "looters, moochers, and parasites" (aptly borrowing from Ayn Rand).

It's undeniable that the RIAA/MPAA are leveraging government to protect their business model (Randian looter behavior), but how you perceive this action has a lot to do with which side of the fence you're on. If you're on the outside looking to get in, the RIAA/MPAA are looters. If you're on the inside looking to control who gets in, those on the outside are moochers.

Those with an objectivist viewpoint won't be able to see this scenario in any other way. The RIAA/MPAA are easy villains, and play the part of the looter very well. They don't even appear to try and compete in the market. They just run to the government for cover. That doesn't, in and of itself, validate the "Megabox disruption" theory.

The RIAA/MPAA don't view their actions any differently than a business owner who calls the police when someone steals a product from the shelf in their store. Yes, I'm completely aware of the difference. It has been discussed ad nauseum in plenty of places. Digital goods can't be stolen, blah blah blah. I get it. I agree to some extent, but I'm asking you to set aside those views for a moment and consider this chess board from both players' perspectives.

The fundamental debate is really about fair use and free speech.

Fair use - To what extent are we allowed to use copyrighted material without compensation of the rights-holder?

Free speech - What is the obligation of a website operator to police the users of said website?

There's an old saying about fundamental rights that goes something like this: The right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins. In matters of intellectual property, things are not as plain as the nose on your face (ta-dum-tss!).

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#22
post #3

The insinuation is that someone from the media giants signaled FBI that it is time to take these people down. Not saying it is impossible but how would that work? Would they go through a Congressman by paying them? Is there a number you call and can set a bounty for a particular investigation like "investigate this and if you prosecute successfully you get $100k bonus"

Not saying that's how it happened, but improper website takedowns by the US government are not exactly new.

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#23
post #7

No, MegaUpload was shut down after years of investigation, not because big music companies got wind of their recent plans and bribed the FBI or something. I'm a bit concerned as to how things went down, but honestly, MegaUpload had it coming. I'm sure there's lots of people who used it legitimately, but I've personally never seen one person or link to a MegaUpload file online that wasn't meant for piracy.

Perhaps, but taking it down now is certainly no coincidence.

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#24
post #9

The (Hacker News) headline is a bit sensational, over simplified, and speculative. The article simply says MegaUpload was going to release a new site targeting music distribution. If they are guilty of the charges against them, it's very possible that their new venture wouldn't be "legit" at all. Edit: The HN headline, not the Techcrunch headline.

> If they are guilty of the charges against them And what is that? > If they are guilty of the charges against them, it's very possible that their new venture wouldn't be "legit" at all. Sounds... speculative.

> > If they are guilty of the charges against them

> And what is that?

http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3487808

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#25
post #22
post #3

The insinuation is that someone from the media giants signaled FBI that it is time to take these people down. Not saying it is impossible but how would that work? Would they go through a Congressman by paying them? Is there a number you call and can set a bounty for a particular investigation like "investigate this and if you prosecute successfully you get $100k bonus"

Not saying that's how it happened, but improper website takedowns by the US government are not exactly new.

I know. But this is more than just a website take -down. There are individuals being extradited. This involves some actual legwork, not just sending an email to an name registrar or an ISP.

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#26
mmmm looks more of an another "conspiracy theory" to me than something real.

For example this service was announced one month ago, so the whole operation has only been planned for one month by the FBI? Seems highly suspicious, it takes months to years to do something in several countries at the same time...

More proof is needed that just a small coincidence.

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#27
post #7

No, MegaUpload was shut down after years of investigation, not because big music companies got wind of their recent plans and bribed the FBI or something. I'm a bit concerned as to how things went down, but honestly, MegaUpload had it coming. I'm sure there's lots of people who used it legitimately, but I've personally never seen one person or link to a MegaUpload file online that wasn't meant for piracy.

Perhaps, but taking it down now is certainly no coincidence.

What evidence makes you say that? "Timing" is not going to convince me; that self-referentially uses the fact that prompted the question as its own answer.

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#28

Note: please read this all the way through before down/up voting. I'm not defending any actors here, I'm just trying to present an "all sides considered" view of the situation. I think there's a fair amount of "projecting" going on here. More and more, I see the intellectual property discussion being couched in the language of "looters, moochers, and parasites" (aptly borrowing from Ayn Rand). It's undeniable that th…

The shutdown of MegaUpload was the result of an FBI investigation that took place over the last two years. The idea that an international legal case with multiple extradition arrangements was motivated mostly by a music service launched a month ago is hard to swallow and distracts from the serious debate around online piracy and the future of copyright.

Re: Was Megaupload Targeted Because Of Its Upcoming Megabox Digital Jukebox Service?

#30

Note: please read this all the way through before down/up voting. I'm not defending any actors here, I'm just trying to present an "all sides considered" view of the situation. I think there's a fair amount of "projecting" going on here. More and more, I see the intellectual property discussion being couched in the language of "looters, moochers, and parasites" (aptly borrowing from Ayn Rand). It's undeniable that th…

"Those with an objectivist viewpoint won't be able to see this scenario in any other way."

What? The Objectivist viewpoint is exactly opposite to what you say. Intellectual property is property (Hank Rearden's steel formula was his and his alone, John Galt's engine is his and his ideas are his property) and strong intellectual property rights enforcement are natural rights of their holders, just like ownership of tangible property (and the enforcement thereof) is. The rights holders are the artists/producers etc, who entered into a voluntary business transaction with their labels, distributors etc. who in turn united in the RIAA/MPAA to collective defend their rights. All voluntarily, and every actor in these transactions is looking out for their own interests, and are morally well within their rights to do so.

Having strong intellectual property protection laws isn't rent seeking. It's only rent seeking when it preys on the creation of others who haven't voluntarily entered into a business relationship with the actors at hand. Objectivist dogma says that protecting man's rights (including property rights) is one of the few legitimate government functions.

I truly do not understand how you come to the conclusion that under an Objectivist world view, it would be the RIAA/MPAA who are the looters, rather than those who wish to take the intellectual property of others without the creator's consent, and I would be interested in seeing a further developed argument to that effect.

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