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Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

arstechnica.com

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Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#61

Post by Nullabillity »

JCharante wrote: post #50
chris_overseas wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> eSIMs are a massive win when travelling, too. Instantly activate a data plan at cheap local rates in whatever country your travelling to, without having to first get your hands on a physical SIM... For many years I've owned dual-SIM phones and on many occasions have bought a local SIM a the airport or corner store when travelling for a week or more to countires outside my roaming allowance. This is almost always ch…

While a local sim is always cheaper than something resold, apps like Nomad make buying a 3-5GB esim in the range of $15-25 super easy. It might cost only $2 for that if you were to buy a local sim in-person, but as long as the cost is not absurd then it's worth the convenience of having internet as soon as the plane lands & while going through the airport without having to rely on the wifi.

10xing the cost is pretty absurd, though...

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#62

Post by Nullabillity »

trollied wrote: post #58
masklinn wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it allows their customers to easily switch service. It’s not like switching is difficult even with a physical SIM.

It can be made difficult if you want to keep your number. Years ago I worked for a startup mobile operator. The incumbents didn't like the new threat, and did all sorts of shenanigans to stop growth, things like paying people to object to new cell sites etc. One of these things was releasing ported numbers on the last possible day. So, while you had your new device and SIM card, you didn't yet have your old number. T…

What does that have to do with the physical SIMs, though?

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#63

Post by krzyk »

thedays wrote: post #2

eSIMs are less convenient and less flexible than regular SIM cards - will iSIMs be any different? How many iSIMs will a phone support? Will they support dual iSIMs or triple iSIMs so I can use one mobile number for work, another for my personal life and a third to use when I'm travelling overseas and want to avoid expensive roaming charges?

eSIMs are more convenient - few days ago I changed carriers, and it was done just on the phone - I didn't have to go to physical store, I didn't had to wait for the SIM card to arrive by mail.

The only issue I can see is that I can't take that card out and put it in a USB modem to use in my router. But I have seperate SIM for that, that has cheaper data plan than my ordinary phone.

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#64

Post by usrusr »

numpad0 wrote: post #48
Reason077 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "But it’s disappointing all round. I absolutely love how easy it is for me to buy a new phone, swap in my old SIM and I’m instantly using my old number." In theory, with an eSIM it's even easier to swap in your old SIM because you don't have to deal with the physical SIM card. Especially so if you don't have the physical SIM because it's lost or whatever. In my experience it's super frustrating to have to wait for…

What you have described is an “artist’s impression” diagram but not how it works IRL. Having physical SIM removes the requirement of the entire phone having to be a certified malware proof secure device, which is hard and a bit anti-consumer.

Just imagine how nice things could be if physical SIM also doubled as a trust enclave for all your TFA etc needs that could be easily transferred to a new device, survive through OS reinstalls and so on.

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#65

Post by KennyBlanken »

Reason077 wrote: post #17
chamakits wrote: post #4

This seems like an inevitability; since eSIMs are already here, and manufacturers are going to be thrilled to have fewer moving parts. But it’s disappointing all round. I absolutely love how easy it is for me to buy a new phone, swap in my old SIM and I’m instantly using my old number. As painful as transferring everything else is with new phones, at least I easily keep the same number. With this (and I’d guess with…

> "But it’s disappointing all round. I absolutely love how easy it is for me to buy a new phone, swap in my old SIM and I’m instantly using my old number." In theory, with an eSIM it's even easier to swap in your old SIM because you don't have to deal with the physical SIM card. Especially so if you don't have the physical SIM because it's lost or whatever. In my experience it's super frustrating to have to wait for…

> In theory, with an eSIM it's even easier to swap in your old SIM because you don't have to deal with the physical SIM card. Especially so if you don't have the physical SIM because it's lost or whatever. In my experience it's super frustrating to have to wait for a new SIM to arrive in the mail because you lost it or the old one is faulty!

"Even easier" until eSIMs become commonplace or the default, and then manufacturers and OS vendors start locking things down. I'm guessing there are few, if any, regulations around eSIMs.

> eSIMs are a massive win when travelling, too. Instantly activate a data plan at cheap local rates in whatever country your travelling to, without having to first get your hands on a physical SIM...

Not without a data connection, you can't. Meanwhile in most of the world you can walk into any bodega and walk out a minute or two later with a SIM that pops into your phone. Hell, in damn near any country you can have a SIM in your phone before you've left the airport.

The push for eSIMs has little to do with "reducing parts counts" or thinner devices, and everything to do with carriers wanting more control over their customers now that they have to unlock people's phones, by law. Right now I can pop a SIM out of a damaged phone, pop it into a new phone. Or buy a temporary plan and swap SIMs when traveling, just by going into any corner market. Even in the US, you can get a SIM damn near anywhere. Supermarkets, convenience stores, bodegas, electronics stores, cell phone shops.

Mark my words, we'll start seeing eSIM transfer fees, locks, policies - all designed to keep people from participating in a free market for cell phone services. Probably mandatory app installation, too - and of course the apps will demand a ton of permissions for things like "fraud prevention", when really they just want to snarf even more of your data.

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#66

Post by wkat4242 »

Reason077 wrote: post #17
chamakits wrote: post #4

This seems like an inevitability; since eSIMs are already here, and manufacturers are going to be thrilled to have fewer moving parts. But it’s disappointing all round. I absolutely love how easy it is for me to buy a new phone, swap in my old SIM and I’m instantly using my old number. As painful as transferring everything else is with new phones, at least I easily keep the same number. With this (and I’d guess with…

> "But it’s disappointing all round. I absolutely love how easy it is for me to buy a new phone, swap in my old SIM and I’m instantly using my old number." In theory, with an eSIM it's even easier to swap in your old SIM because you don't have to deal with the physical SIM card. Especially so if you don't have the physical SIM because it's lost or whatever. In my experience it's super frustrating to have to wait for…

It's great if they make it easy but it also gives them lots of control to make things difficult if they want to. With physical SIMs they don't have this option short of blacklisting unknown IMEIs which would cause them a huge support burden.

I like the idea of eSIM but this quick transfer should be mandatory, not an option.

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#68

Post by Symbiote »

chris_overseas wrote: post #44
Reason077 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "But it’s disappointing all round. I absolutely love how easy it is for me to buy a new phone, swap in my old SIM and I’m instantly using my old number." In theory, with an eSIM it's even easier to swap in your old SIM because you don't have to deal with the physical SIM card. Especially so if you don't have the physical SIM because it's lost or whatever. In my experience it's super frustrating to have to wait for…

> eSIMs are a massive win when travelling, too. Instantly activate a data plan at cheap local rates in whatever country your travelling to, without having to first get your hands on a physical SIM... For many years I've owned dual-SIM phones and on many occasions have bought a local SIM a the airport or corner store when travelling for a week or more to countires outside my roaming allowance. This is almost always ch…

How do eSIMs work for identity verification?

The last several times I've bought SIMs outside Europe, I've had to show my passport.

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#69

Post by Uptrenda »

Wasn't one of the benefits of a smart card model was having a totally isolated chip that could run minimal software and provide a limited surface for attack? If you add everything to the same chip then doesn't this reduce the advantages of having that separate smart card (together with it's anti-tampering design)? We're also supposed to trust Qualcomm that this is secure... Sounds totally legit.

SIM cards aren't perfect but I feel like there is a benefit to them. Especially since they use the same tech as credit card chips, don't they (universal integrated circuit cards.) It's hard for me to want to trust this as much as a platform used by literally every consumer payment bank and carrier out there vs Qualcomms priority spec. I think anyone who does secure communication already doesn't want to touch Qualcomm products because you can't audit their designs. Unfortunately, that's usually what is shipped as the baseband modem in most phones... A single company making one of the most important communication products... Nope, no problem there...

Re: Qualcomm wants to replace eSIMs with iSIMs, has the first certified SoC

#70

Post by Gasp0de »

Symbiote wrote: post #68
chris_overseas wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> eSIMs are a massive win when travelling, too. Instantly activate a data plan at cheap local rates in whatever country your travelling to, without having to first get your hands on a physical SIM... For many years I've owned dual-SIM phones and on many occasions have bought a local SIM a the airport or corner store when travelling for a week or more to countires outside my roaming allowance. This is almost always ch…

How do eSIMs work for identity verification? The last several times I've bought SIMs outside Europe, I've had to show my passport.

Outside Europe? Identity verification is mandatory in the EU and afaik there are very few states that haven't implemented it in local law (the netherlands and croatia, I think).
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