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Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

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31–40 of 83 posts

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#31
post #22

This is an extremely cool project, but after browsing the source code a bit, it looks like it's badly in need of modernization. CSS is Bootstrap 3. The docs reference Web Components, and I do see the use of customElements.define() so (I think?) it's using "real" Web Components technologies, but the code is indecipherable to me: var n = t.getAttribute('name') || ''; if (!n) return; var p = t.getAttribute(T_PATH) || 'n…

> CSS is Bootstrap 3. > there's liberal use of "var" > The components implementation is very pythonic - it passes "self" around to decorate with functions Could you explain why these things are bad, other than "it's not the hip and trendy way to do things"?

Sure.

Using Bootstrap 3 is a problem because it hasn't been supported for over three years and is no longer actively maintained [1]. This is a problem for many reasons, security and maintenance among them.

The use of var has long been understood to be problematic due to footguns with scoping issues. It's the reason "let" was introduced into the language, and is pretty much exclusively used now.

The pythonic approach isn't a problem per-se, but it also introduces additional complexity which makes maintenance more challenging.

From an organizational standpoint, it's difficult to attract and retain good talent to work on dated code. I don't think any developer would be excited to put "Bootstrap 3" on their resume today. If you can't attract and retain good talent, your company and project will suffer.

Software is like a house, there are many complex systems that need periodic maintenance and updating. Sometimes you can remodel the house to get rid of the aluminum wiring, etc... and modernize it. Sometimes it's cheaper to tear down and rebuild. But I don't think anyone would argue "Well, it hasn't fallen over yet so just leave it".

[1] https://endoflife.date/bootstrap

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#32

When I see low-code, I find myself looking for the Visual Basic of Web. If I could drag and drop a few pre-made controls (including a database control), double click to handle a few events, and have a CRUD app, I would be thrilled. Unfortunately, I still have not found that yet.

I actually have been wondering if we can skip drag and drop even, and build a CRUD app with a markdown like language.

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#33

This is an extremely cool project, but after browsing the source code a bit, it looks like it's badly in need of modernization. CSS is Bootstrap 3. The docs reference Web Components, and I do see the use of customElements.define() so (I think?) it's using "real" Web Components technologies, but the code is indecipherable to me: var n = t.getAttribute('name') || ''; if (!n) return; var p = t.getAttribute(T_PATH) || 'n…

The code isn't terrible, but it's not clear to you because you don't have the necessary information. The Total.js UI library (jComponent) is now 50% backward compatible with the UI library that you opened in 2014! You must know that we want to keep long-term backward compatibility. It's not a 100% nice code and of course, we will release a new version v20 (of UI library) this or next year cleared from the older code.…

I think the project is very cool, and I'm impressed with the amount of functionality it has.

I do think there's a considerable burden of technical debt in the current code base right now that the company will need to develop a strategy to address, which is absolutely normal for a project of this scope and age.

It's a tough challenge, one I've faced several times.

Given the clear technical talent I see with the project, I have every confidence that it's a challenge that will be overcome, and I'm looking forward to watching the project and seeing how it progresses.

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#34
post #16

This is an extremely cool project, but after browsing the source code a bit, it looks like it's badly in need of modernization. CSS is Bootstrap 3. The docs reference Web Components, and I do see the use of customElements.define() so (I think?) it's using "real" Web Components technologies, but the code is indecipherable to me: var n = t.getAttribute('name') || ''; if (!n) return; var p = t.getAttribute(T_PATH) || 'n…

Why can't code just be old? If it's stable, sustainable, and able to deliver on customer needs, then who cares? The only benefit at that point be to prevent people nitpicking that their code uses "var".

In most cases, I'd agree with you - but I think this one is a little different since the customer is a technical implementer building a product.

For some use cases, I think it would be fine - internal tools that need a quick and easy solution, perhaps.

But I don't think anyone feels great about building a product on an aging foundation.

Would you select Angular 1 as a UI framework for a new project today?

Also, I think it's hard to make a good argument for single letter variable names, except in very rare cases. Unfortunately, in this code base their use is the norm rather than the exception.

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#35
post #27

I cannot seem to find the price of the “premium” components.

Our team is currently working on the Total.js Enterprise service, which will provide all premium content (Private Cloud, Flow + UI Builder, CMS widgets, CMS templates, etc.). We are offering these components for testing purposes for some members. The price will be appropriate and not excessive. If someone wants only some parts, we will be able to sell them independently.

Feel free to email me or contact me via Telegram: https://t.me/petersirka if you want to use some special Flow components.

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#36

> Premium components Mmmm. Guarantees I'll never touch this.

We did a ton of free components and apps, and we have been doing it for 10 years. - More than 10 apps - The number of UI components exceeds 300 - The number of flow components exceeds 100 - More than 60 components in UI Builder Internally, we have 9 people in full-time employment, they need salary. As a result, we would like to sell some premium components in order to earn money for the next development, but that's a…

It's very valid to sell premium blocks/packs. It's really amazing to have all the rest in the MIT version open-core. Thanks for that and don't be demoralized by some comments, we don't all think the same.

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#37
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> CSS is Bootstrap 3. > there's liberal use of "var" > The components implementation is very pythonic - it passes "self" around to decorate with functions Could you explain why these things are bad, other than "it's not the hip and trendy way to do things"?

Sure. Using Bootstrap 3 is a problem because it hasn't been supported for over three years and is no longer actively maintained [1]. This is a problem for many reasons, security and maintenance among them. The use of var has long been understood to be problematic due to footguns with scoping issues. It's the reason "let" was introduced into the language, and is pretty much exclusively used now. The pythonic approach…

We only use Bootstrap v3's grid system (CSS).

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#38
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We did a ton of free components and apps, and we have been doing it for 10 years. - More than 10 apps - The number of UI components exceeds 300 - The number of flow components exceeds 100 - More than 60 components in UI Builder Internally, we have 9 people in full-time employment, they need salary. As a result, we would like to sell some premium components in order to earn money for the next development, but that's a…

It's very valid to sell premium blocks/packs. It's really amazing to have all the rest in the MIT version open-core. Thanks for that and don't be demoralized by some comments, we don't all think the same.

Thank you a lot!

Re: Show HN: Total.js – Low-code development (Node-RED alternative)

#39
post #25

Had the unfortune to have to work with Total.js a few years ago.. safe to say I'm never touching it again.

Care to elaborate? Without context, your comment doesn’t really tell us anything useful to make a decision or verdict on.
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